Patti LuPone called a privileged, racially microaggressive bully by Hell's Kitchen cast member — Page 6

binau said: "Genuine question for those in the US - is what we are seeing in this thread a common occurrence or is it unusual? I’m shocked at where this has gone!"

Sadly pretty common in this day and age

binau said: "Genuine question for those in the US - is what we are seeing in this thread a common occurrence or is it unusual? I’m shocked at where this has gone!"

Yes, especially on the internet and on social media where it's easier to unleash. I'm sure we could all write paragraphs on it and while it's super amplified right now it's nothing entirely "new" - nuance, ambiguity, complexity feeling scary/threatening and bringing up unpleasant feelings for people... a wanting for all things to be clear-cut and easily categorizable. It's frustrating and also at the same time weirdly understandable (not to say it's right or desireable). But all to say, yes, what you are seeing in this thread is a common occurrence right now.

Updated On: 11/4/24 at 01:27 PM

What bothers me so much about this situation is that because race has been implicated in something that so clearly and objectively was nothing to do with race, things that deserve our attention through that lens don't get it. It's like crying wolf. We've all sat in a theater on 44th or 45th street and heard noise bleed. We know it is a real thing that happens. I forget what show it was, but the tenant in the Golden even said something about hearing Patti's Ladies Who Lunch through the walls when she was next door at the Jacobs. This is truly all to do about nothing and making Patti out to be a racist in this context is so beyond and unserious. But that's the narrative people are running with.

Not since Cynthia Erivo…

One can view this situation through so many different lenses to decide what you make of it: appropriateness, hierarchy, star power, race, gender, Patti's reputation, et al.

People are looking at the same situation through different lenses and filters, reaching different conclusions as a result, and talking past each other. While I don't think that is unique to the US right now, tone could probably make a case that the frequency with which it happens and the steadfastness with which people defend their takes is on the rise.

HeyMrMusic said: "Not saying this hasn’t blown out of proportion, but flippantly saying or implying that Black people are too loud in the way Patti did to that fan IS a microaggression. We also don’t know how the change in sound design affected or compromised the performances ofHell’s Kitchenand how those changes had to be implemented by cast, crew, and band."

Finally someone with critical thinking skills on this board. Thank goodness.

OhHiii said: "Ensemble1698878795 said: "TotallyEffed said: "OharaFosseWolfe888 said: "Y'all telling Black how to respond is insane and wild. All of these comments continue to not only not accept but bend over backwards to find an excuse for her. You don't even have to accept but again to disregard Black folks who tell you IT IS a microaggression is sad AF."

The issue with this argument is that you're telling everyone else how to respond. You're telling Patti how to respond. It can't work both ways. Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and opinions."

No actually everyone isn't entitled to their opinions. Case in point: all you white people on this board can't make space or sense ofKecia's feelings. They don't matter to you and you attempt to police HOW she expresses them. Maybe Kecia went to the powers that be and was ignored."

Actually, everyone is looking at this through a critical lens and coming to a different conclusion than you. But I'll say one thing, assuming that all of those of us saying this is overblown are white is absolutely wild given all you know about any of us is a screen name. Hurling accusations that are not appropriate to the situation is the problem here and you just provided another example."

I have deeply agreed with what Ensemble1698878795 has said. I would also make the assumption most people on this board are white, by how they respond. I would also say this board is mostly cis white gay men. That's not a unfathomable assumption either. The point is, most have commented are mad at Kecia for going to social media and making this public and calling Patti a racist, which she did not. Regardless of race, most on this board do not want to hold the possibility that it was a microaggression. Every time a non seemingly Black person says....that is a microaggression no one responds to them. Because you don't WANT to understand. You would rather sit in your privilege of your POV than listening to actual Black people who have those experiences. Again, disheartening and sad.

Broadway61004 said: "OharaFosseWolfe888 said: "Y'all telling Black how to respond is insane and wild. All of these comments continue to not only not accept but bend over backwards to find an excuse for her. You don't even have to accept but again to disregard Black folks who tell you IT IS a microaggression is sad AF."

There's a huge difference between telling someone how to respond and calling someone out for slandering someone incorrectly.

No one is saying that Ms. Lewis doesn't have the right to have been offended by Ms. Lupone's actions or to disagree with how her producing team handled it or to even express that it hurt her that her show was changed. Those are all completely fine reactions and no one should tell her how she should feel otherwise.

But what is not okay is publicly making accusations of racism towards someone because you didn't like the way they handled a situation that has nothing to do with race. Even if you feel personally that there was some level of racist intent behind it, Ms. Lupone's actions in no way implied that and calling them (and her) racist is 100% slander and 100% not okay. If she wanted to express this privately to Patti that she felt that way? Completely fine. But the minute you go online and start tossing around accusations that you damage someone's livelihood, you absolutely deserve to be called out for it if it's something that was clearly misinterpreted and blown out of proportion by you. Ms. Lewis can feel however she wants to feel about the situation. But that doesn't mean she has the right to put someone on blast just because she feels a certain way."

The POC inside the situation gets to decide if they feel the actions towards them were racially charged, not the comments section. Racism is going around telling POC that their experiences "aren't racially based." It's very clear how ignorant some of you are to the fullness of how this works. You're constantly perpetuating the very behavior you're denying.

OharaFosseWolfe888 said: "OhHiii said: "Ensemble1698878795 said: "TotallyEffed said: "OharaFosseWolfe888 said: "Y'all telling Black how to respond is insane and wild. All of these comments continue to not only not accept but bend over backwards to find an excuse for her. You don't even have to accept but again to disregard Black folks who tell you IT IS a microaggression is sad AF."

The issue with this argument is that you're telling everyone else how to respond. You're telling Patti how to respond. It can't work both ways. Everyone is entitled to their own feelings and opinions."

No actually everyone isn't entitled to their opinions. Case in point: all you white people on this board can't make space or sense ofKecia's feelings. They don't matter to you and you attempt to police HOW she expresses them. Maybe Kecia went to the powers that be and was ignored."

Actually, everyone is looking at this through a critical lens and coming to a different conclusion than you. But I'll say one thing, assuming that all of those of us saying this is overblown are white is absolutely wild given all you know about any of us is a screen name. Hurling accusations that are not appropriate to the situation is the problem here and you just provided another example."

I have deeply agreed with whatEnsemble1698878795 has said. I would also make the assumption most people on this board are white, by how they respond. I would also say this board is mostly cis white gay men. That's not a unfathomable assumption either. The point is, most have commented are mad at Kecia for going to social media and making this public and calling Patti a racist, which she did not. Regardless of race, most on this board do not want to hold the possibility that it was a microaggression. Every time a non seemingly Black person says....that is a microaggression no one responds to them. Because you don't WANT to understand. You would rather sit in your privilege of your POV than listening to actual Black people who have those experiences. Again, disheartening and sad."

Boom Kat. You said what they don't wanna hear.

Ensemble1698878795 said: "The POC inside the situation gets to decide if they feel the actions towards themwere racially charged, not the comments section. Racism is going around telling POC that their experiences "aren't racially based." It's very clear how ignorant some of you are to the fullness of how this works. You're constantly perpetuating the very behavior you're denying."

The people (POC or not is irrelevant) absolutely get to decide how they FEEL about the situation. That does not give them the right to make defamatory statements about others regardless of how they feel.

Not sure what you're not comprehending here. No one is arguing that someone can't feel a certain way.

It’s amazing to witness the division between groups of people that are meant to be on the same side. Incredible and jaw dropping. I still haven’t had any clear response to these questions by the way:

1. do you think if Audra was in a one woman play at the booth that Hell’s Kitchen wouldn’t accomodate her ?

2. Why is everyone focussed on Patti when the producers made clear it’s a range of people, including the audience

And I’ll add a third

3. if American idiot was at the Schubert right now do you believe that Patti also wouldn’t describe the show as loud or her production team not ask to turn it down (assuming that it was as loud as Hell’s Kitchen. From the reports here it’s the loudest broadway show I’ve ever heard of - I’ve never heard these kind of reports in other shows)