Sondheim and Ives' HERE WE ARE at The Shed- Page 35

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:15pm

BoringBoredBoard40 said: "Right which means Sondheim didn't think it was finished to his standard but got talked into it by other people and at this point he is dead so who knows what is actually the real story"


In his own words, writing a musical is solving a series of problems.

The impression I've got from the articles (and other intel) is that Sondheim was stuck, facing writer's block, and slowing down. When Ives and Mantello had this idea of doing Act 2 with very little (no?) music, he jumped at the idea. I think he wanted the show to be finished, and if him not having to write a score for the second act means it could be finished, that's a win for him...and it solves an aforementioned problem.

[Georgeanddot2]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:22pm

Sooooooo?  For those who were there, I'm DYING to hear what you all think!!

[ColorTheHours048]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:31pm

There is much to unpack, and I don’t know that I’ll be able to do that on the train platform waiting for the A, but these are my fresh thoughts.

I can’t help but wish we had gotten the full show Sondheim had intended. As it is, it doesn’t feel incomplete - per se - but it feels like a show divided. Based on my understanding of Frank Rich’s interview with Ives and Mantello, they found a sort of dramaturgical connection between Sondheim’s writer’s block (and obviously, later, death) and the lack of much music in the latter half. Whether that artistic “choice” pays off, your mileage may vary. But for now, we have a pretty great Sondheim score in act one, and a fairly book-heavy act two that doesn’t fully stick the landing.

The good:

• Sondheim’s. Act one. Score. It may not be a masterpiece, but it has all of the stuff that makes his work unmatched in the musical theatre canon. It’s chaotic, funny, clever, suddenly gorgeous, and brimming with life. He writes music the way people speak and feel, in different tempos and colors and styles. It’s never not fascinating, and there’s much of it I can’t wait to revisit - particularly Denis O’Hare‘s “Café Everything” number and Jin Ha and Micaela Diamond’s duet. If you’re coming for the Sondheim, act one gives you more than the price of admission‘s worth.
• The cast. They are all clearly having a blast together, and with how much comedy there is to mine, it’ll only get more fun the more they relax into it. Rachel Bay Jones is giving the Jennifer Coolidge/Jennifer Tilly fantasy I didn’t know I needed; Tracie Bennett is nearly unrecognizable scene-to-scene, playing what I believe was 4 different characters (all hysterical); and Denis O’Hare is at his malevolent best. Everyone else is excellent, but those three are operating at their peak.
• The design. I loved the consistent surprise of how we would get from place to place. Some of the most ingenious stage design I’ve seen in quite some time. To say much more would be a spoiler, but the reveals on reveals continuously pay off. It’s both elaborate/ornate and modern/sleek. Very cool.

The less good (no bad):

• David Ives’s book. I much preferred the quick zaniness of act one to the talky, exposition-laden second act. The jokes and plot mechanics flow so much better and get to the emotional point more satisfyingly, and suddenly there’s logic. It’s lopsided and needed Sondheim’s touch more. There’s still a lot to like, and I’m making it sound less satisfying than it is, but I can’t help but wonder “what if?”

It is a wonderful evening of theatre that will only get better and funnier with some time and a little editing. It was a genuine thrill to be in that room, and I’m so excited for people to experience it.

Updated On: 9/29/23 at 11:31 PM

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:40pm

I'm pretty buzzed right now but I agree with pretty much everything said above. I think overall I liked Ives' book more than you did (overall) and found the absolute absurdity of it to be one of the more refreshing things I've seen in a long time. 

Yes, this show absolutely does feel incomplete, though. But I think given the circumstances it's totally forgivable and not something that I hold against what we do get. Had Sondheim lived I have no doubt there would have been songs given to people in act two, especially the Maid. That character is CRYING OUT for a big number. 

There's just so much to unpack and think over tonight, though. But overall, I truly truly had a wonderful time tonight and can't wait to go back next week.  

[TaffyDavenport]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:43pm

For those interested, it looks like this was taken from HH 203. Looks like a great view, in my opinion:




 

 

Updated On: 9/28/23 at 11:43 PM

[StylishCynic]

Posted: 9/28/23 at 11:55pm

Act one was a marvel. I wish it could go on forever. 
 

Act two was a different animal. I completely agree that it was never the creative intention to have act two without songs throughout.

Still, I agree that the world needed this, and having it as-is is better than not having it at all. There’s a stupendous Sondheim debut that I’m be imagining in my head until I’m “dust”. 
 

 

Click Here To Toggle Spoiler Content

I was really hoping that there would be a finale song you’d think that despite Sondheim’s struggle to understand why the characters would sing once in the room would mean that he did have something in mind to end the show.

 

Updated On: 9/28/23 at 11:55 PM

[StylishCynic]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 12:07am

forfivemoreminutes said: "The stage looks pretty high in the photos. Does it look high in person? Would you have to crane your neck?"

If you aren’t sitting on the sides, the 5th row starts eye-level with the stage. 
 

I also recommend sitting facing the stage if you can swing it. There’s beautiful framing visuals on both sides, and the beginning of act two is really gobsmacking if you sit facing the stage. (The sides didn’t see what we were clapping about.)

[signorafosca2]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 12:32am

TaffyDavenport said: "For those interested, it looks like this was taken from HH 203. Looks like a great view, in my opinion:






"

That was indeed a picture I took from HH203.

[bear88]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 12:47am

I will be on the other side. How were the seats for this show?

[Matt Rogers]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 12:54am

But....but....but...I was informed that I did not know what I was talking about when I said that Act Two was not full of songs!

[uncageg]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 12:57am

BoringBoredBoard40 said: "Right which means Sondheim didn't think it was finished to his standard but got talked into it by other people and at this point he is dead so who knows what is actually the real story"

 

Exactly, so what you think happened may not be the "real story" unless you were part of the discussions. And I am sure you were not.

 

[ljay889]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:02am

I keep thinking about how light, breezy, and funny the score is. Sondheim clearly had fun writing act 1.

The only comparison I can think of for the music is Forum with a touch of Road Show. It’s not his best work, but I am grateful that we have it.

 

Click Here To Toggle Spoiler Content

I agree, I was really hoping the show would end with a “Perfect Day” reprise to at least close with some singing. 
 

I  smiled every time Cannavale’s character mentioned being “back at Square One” - knowing how Sondheim wanted that as the title.

Also, Sondheim writing a lyric about receiving head wasn’t on my bingo card, lol. 

 

[Matt Rogers]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:09am

ljay889 said: "

I keep thinking about how light, breezy, and funny the score is. Sondheim clearly had fun writing act 1.

The only comparison I can think of for the music is Forum with a touch of Road Show. It’s not his best work, but I am grateful that we have it.

 

I can see it on the Broadway marquee now: "Forum with a touch of Road Show" - also - you just unsold me a ticket. 

 

Updated On: 9/29/23 at 01:09 AM

[Georgeanddot2]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:18am

Matt Rogers said: "ljay889 said: "

I keep thinking about how light, breezy, and funny the score is. Sondheim clearly had fun writing act 1.

The only comparison I can think of for the music is Forum with a touch of Road Show. It’s not his best work, but I am grateful that we have it.

 

 

 

I can see it on the Broadway marquee now: "Forum with a touch of Road Show" - also - you just unsold me a ticket."

 

 

Please go find a flight of stairs to fall down.

[BoringBoredBoard40]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:27am

uncageg said: "BoringBoredBoard40 said: "Right which means Sondheim didn't think it was finished to his standard but got talked into it by other people and at this point he is dead so who knows what is actually the real story"



Exactly, so what you think happened may not be the "real story" unless you were part of the discussions. And I am sure you were not.

"

It is literally the story they are spinning in that profile that came out last week.

Also get bent. 

 

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:29am

Also really want to make sure I point out that there is not a single weak link in this cast. Every single person is spot on and perfect. 

[dan94]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:31am

That was really something special. The cast were uniformly pretty excellent. Sleek stylish production that seemed to make perfect use of the space.

As for the elephant in the room - yes only 10-15 mins of Act Two are composed, and yes it does feel like there is missing music. It doesn't matter. Act One is excellent and reveals Sondheim in pretty peak form. He's playing with motif in interesting ways. He's still experimenting rhythmically. The wordplay gets laughs. And yes - the Jin Ha/Diamond duet is just gorgeous.

The big regret of the evening is that we don't have another 2 or 3 Sondheim/Ives musicals because Sondheim and Ives are a match made in heaven. They speak the same language and bring out exciting visceral work from each other.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:33am

God, that duet was gorgeous. 

[ljay889]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 1:34am

It’s really amazing how perfectly cast every single actor is in this.  Like I can’t picture anyone else in these roles. Clearly Lane and Peters did the one reading as a favor, because they wouldn’t be believable as Leo and Marianne. 

[devonian.t]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 3:13am

On the boards we will inevitably play "what if", but it is a relief that something special is being presented as "what is".

So probably entirely premature, but best revival and best musical would be a grand finale.

[MrBroucek]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 5:32am

Im sure at somepont SJS said it would be a one act musical?

Do the two acts fit together?

In light of everything that did and did not happen I can’t help but think it would be stronger condensing the second half into a shorter section and making it a one act show.

[JasonC3]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 6:00am

MrBroucek said: "Im sure at somepont SJS said it would be a one act musical?

Do the two acts fit together?

In light of everything that did and did not happen I can’t help but think it would be stronger condensing the second half into a shorter section and making it a one act show."

This reminds me a bit of how some people felt (and perhaps still feel) about Sunday in the Park with George. I wonder how people completely unaware of the show's development react to the two acts. I guess we may start hearing some of that over more performances.

 

[ColorTheHours048]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 7:23am

The two acts work together very well, to be clear. It’s meant to be divided in two distinct sections, and for purely technical reasons, I can understand why there’s an intermission. And while Ives may do some trimming to his book, it won’t be enough to justify making this one act. For one, it would be exhausting to sit through a 2+ hour show like this. Additionally, it needs the intermission to let you breathe and reset.

But there’s also a fun meta-theatricality to it all. In act one when the plot is fairly straightforward - people search for a place to have brunch - the set and dialogue are ultra artificial. Everything is suggestion. But then when act two comes along and the plot gets absurd - people stuck in a room for unknown reasons - we’re in a tangible world that feels the most like a traditional play. Then they’re free to go back to their world of theatricality and possibility. It’s a neat little directorial and design trick that makes the two acts gel really beautifully.

So is it finished? Who can ever be sure. But there’s nothing in what I saw last night that implies Sondheim wouldn’t have simply replaced some of the talking with singing and everything else remained as it was.

Updated On: 9/29/23 at 07:23 AM

[RippedMan]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 7:31am

Well now I really hope there’s a promo code or something! I don’t suspect this to be a hot ticket though. 

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 9/29/23 at 7:42am

Act two is the longer of the two acts and I think it would greatly benefit from some trimming, I’d even say at least ten or so minutes. There got to be a point about 3/4 into it where I was like “we can wrap this up now”. It’s not at all that I wasn’t enjoying it, I really truly was, but I think act two is so insanely absurdist and bizarre that it becomes…a lot.