The Wiz at a ... white HS- Page 2

[LostLeander]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 10:20am

I did not say The Wiz was written for white people. I must have not made my sentence structure clear enough - but I was saying that like KMK, the Wiz was written with a certain race in mind; KMK - white people, Wiz - black people. I'm sorry that was not clear.

White kids who don't know how to talk jive and sing soul is disastrous. But if you have kids (no matter what race) who can act and sing the book/score, then I say do it.

BTW, black people don't talk jive anymore, so it's probably just as foreign to black high school kids as it is to the white ones.

" "The Wiz" is all about the African American sensibility in a pretty much white fairy tale. "

I'd say that was merely a theme in the original production of it. The show, as written, is a universal story about a lost girl, trying to find herself, and her way home. It is not ABOUT black people.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 11:30am

No husk, I was saying that we didn't TRY to jive. You do not have to jive The Wiz. White people trying to jive is not cute, I agree. I was saying RATHER than make jive cute, we were just..doing the show. Just cute.

The Wiz does not have hard music. You do not have to "try to be black" when you're performing this. And I use quotes because I hate that saying.

But all in all, I'm with LostLeander on this one.

[Jon]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 11:44am

Anyone who thinks white kids can't "sing black" hasn't been watching American idol over the last few years. Theree are some damn good white R&B singers out there. You think someone like Elliot Yamin couldn't sing the hell out of the Tin Man?

[HumATune]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 11:47am

And then there are black kids who can't "sing black" as well.

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 12:47pm

>> There's a difference. When "The Wiz" was written, it was difficult for African Americans in show business (much more so than now). During that time period, it was required that each show have one minority in the cast.

So what? That was then. This is now, thirty years later.

>> "110 in the Shade" and "Cat on a Hot Tin Roof" are not built around race, and that's where the difference comes in.

Have you actually read CAT? It may not appear race-specific on the surface, but go a little deeper into Williams and his intent, and I think you'd be hardpressed to continue your line. As for Lizzie Currie, that doesnt matter -- she's a white woman in a white man's world. She's not black. We can tap dance around the "race specific" nature of the role, but sorry: the character is a white woman. Period. End of story.

Now, does it bother me that the current production is using colour blind casting in some of its leads? Nope. Audra's gotten rave reviews for her performance, and well merited too. True, it looks a little strange that Lizzie is the *only* black member of the Currie family, which, TTTT, makes her look more like the family maid than the daughter. And it's only slightly stranger that the object of the youngest son's affections is a black girl -- lotsa psychological stuff under the hood of those decisions, let me tell you. If the show had been more multi-racial, you might have a point, but when the only two visible minorities in the leading roles just happen to be the two women's roles, you gotta wonder what was going on in those casting sessions. It almost forces the roles to be seen in terms of race, in a small way, because the director has mirrored them so much.

But insofar as WIZ: it's thirty year old "funk" music, which now, as was posted earlier, we can hear on just about any edition of "Theres a note there somewhere so I'm gonna circle it bit first" AMERICAN IDOL. The music aint tough. The roles are fun. And I say huzzah and hurrah to anyone who wants to perform it: black, white, or even oriental. Just do it and have fun and to &^*% with what anyone says to the contrary.

[HumATune]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 12:53pm

You did not just say oriental. That's like saying "colored".

[Tchi4Lif188]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 12:56pm

Wow, this EXACT same thing JUST happened to me this year. I graduated last year and they decided The Wiz would be the spring musical this year. I didn't get the chance to go, but I heard that it was a train wreck. I think that was due to the lack of talent that's there now though. But if your school has the talent, then it could turn out good. You never know :)

[LostLeander]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 1:08pm

I think your issue, Sean, is the way you view things. If you want to see the black woman in the family of white people as a maid, then you will. And you clearly did.

When I look at the cast list and it says Audra McDonald will be playing Lizzie Curry, daughter of John Cullum's H.C. Curry, I'll say, "Oh, Audra and John are playing father and daughter" - and I'll accept the convention because it's theatre.

BTW, Audra's understudy is white.

You see what you want to see, and I'm sorry that thought ever entered your mind.

And the fact that you said Oriental does not help your argument.

Updated On: 5/20/07 at 01:08 PM

[Switz78]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 1:40pm

"White people doing jive = not cute"

I don't really get that comment. Since when does music have a specific color that can sing it. There are white gospel singers, white rappers, black country artists.
By the way Jive is a dance form from the 40s that songs like Little Bitty Pretty One were written for, not necessarily a style of singing. And I really don't think that The Wiz music could be considered Jive.
Let's not forget that at your average high school (non performing arts)the process is about learning and fun. These are not professional productions. Some schools come close to professional and some don't. These are kids or young adults who are doing something they enjoy. You can't go in expecting to see Audra or Idina or whatever. View it for what it is.
On a side note I find the comments from recent graduates funny. They all seem to think that the show after they left was not great, but maybe they have all been not so hot and you just enjoyed being in them. I'm sure the people that were ahead of you thought the same thing that you do. Just a thought.

[Fenchurch]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 1:46pm

Sorry, there are better shows for white casts than these shows. White people should not be doing the Wiz or OOTI, it's insulting and incredibly offensive.

I totally agree with eatlasagan, way to go for telling it like it is.

It is NOT a two way street.

[outovfashion07]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 3:13pm

I saw an all white cast do the wiz and it had as much "soul" and "jive" as it should have. it is incredibly racist to say that white people cannot do the show JUST because their white.

And the differance is that the sotry of The Wiz is not ABOUT race like Aida's story is. So it doesnt matter what the color of the casts skin is, it matters if they are talented enought o perform the material. PERIOD

[husk_charmer]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 3:29pm

Just a clarification for those who don't know (And if I am wrong, by all means correct me.):
Jive is a mix of dialect and slang.
Soul is a form of music and inflection.

[mrslovett7]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 4:27pm

My high school did it this year and there were literally 2 black people in the show and they weren't lead characters. It went very well, and it doesn't really matter the race, it still works.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 5:49pm

I'm in a production of The Wiz right now that is multiracial, but all the leads are black. I think it's important to stay true to the original intent which was, I believe, to be an urban retelling of the Wizard of Oz and therefor should stay true to the cast being black or in our case mostly black. I don't like the idea of shows being race exclusive unless it's for historical purposes, but the Wiz is a fairy tale and not really historical unless you're trying to remount the original production.

[jordangirl]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 5:52pm

"Now, does it bother me that the current production is using colour blind casting in some of its leads? Nope. Audra's gotten rave reviews for her performance, and well merited too. True, it looks a little strange that Lizzie is the *only* black member of the Currie family, which, TTTT, makes her look more like the family maid than the daughter."

Sorry SeanMartin. You're wrong. Chris Butler, who playe Lizzie's brother Noah is African-American.

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 5:55pm

Fenchurch - What exactly do you find offensive about it? That is, if you do not mind elaborating.

CATS, what you say is a good point but if you simply do not have the talent for a black cast, then I don't see white people portraying the roles to be a big problem. I do not disagree with the fact that The Wiz was written for black people, but it's not ABOUT black people. A friend of mine looks at The Wiz as a sort of representation of a certain culture from that time period, which makes for a good arguement but I think that because it is not ABOUT black people it doesn't HAVE to have black people in it.

At first when we did The Wiz in middle school, I asked the director "Why not just do THE WIZARD OF OZ?" But it's true that The Wiz's music is easier to do than THE WIZARD OF OZ (not that Oz's music is that hard either...but still) I'm not trying to offend anyone in saying that the "black version" is simpler, but the music is easier and there are..jokes. That people can actually laugh at and understand.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 6:04pm

There's the other argument as well that theatres should only do shows that they have the talent for. If you don't have the talent on hand for a black cast then don't do a black show. Don't blame your casting decisions on a lack of talent. Blame it on a lack of a proper show choice.
Updated On: 5/20/07 at 06:04 PM

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 6:14pm

Well yeah. But then people say "The Wiz doesn't HAVE to be a black show".

It's a dark circle we'll never get out of. I swear it.

[SeanMartin]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 8:30pm

>> And the fact that you said Oriental does not help your argument.

Oh please, get a freaking grip. If there's some new politically correct term to use to describe folks who live along the western edge of the Pacific Rim, then kindly enlighten me. Otherwise, dont waste my time trying to cast me a bigot when it wont work.

>> I think your issue, Sean, is the way you view things. If you want to see the black woman in the family of white people as a maid, then you will. And you clearly did.

Nope, you did, pumpkin. I merely suggested the possibility. You turned it into a fait accompli. I repeat, I find it fascinating that the director mirrors the two women the way he did, but that's another issue for another time, IMHO.

If I'm in error about the eldest brother, so be it and my apologies. I'm going on the available photos of the production and what's written in the reviews, so if I missed that, blame someone else.

Now... once again for those who seem outraged that I would use the now-outre term "oriental". I repeat: get over it. Move on. There is no issue there save ones of your own making.

[Switz78]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 9:13pm

I'm wondering why the color blind casting doesn't work both ways. Take for instance the 1 african american chorus member of Pirate Queen, who has dreads. If there was a black man in Ireland in that time period, than why couldn't a white person be in Color Purple and be just as believable? Just a thought. But what about shows that have nothing to do with color? For instance BJ in Smokey Joe's, there is nothing that says the character has to be black, but that's how it is almost always cast. Why? Then there are the regional theatres that are casting white women as Muzzy in Millie which is a bit weird for the plot and time oeriod of the show. IMO at least.
Like I said High School shows are supposed to be educational NOT professional. They break all kinds of licensing rules and change shows to get rid of things they see as inappropriate.
Shouldn't we worry more that schools would rather do Cabaret than Urinetown because the title is offensive, than whether there is a multi-racial cast of a show that was originally intended to be one race?

[AnnaK<3LMIP]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 9:26pm

Well The Color Purple is about the strife of black people, is it not? The Pirate Queen isn't really about the strife of a particular race (white, black, etc..) is it? At least, I don't consider it to be.

I can see a white Muzzy in Millie. But I can't see an Asian Millie.

[husk_charmer]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 10:06pm

AnnaK-
I think you sort of hit the nail on the head. "Wizard of Oz" (The RSC version), is one of the more expensive musicals to produce rights wise...and "The Wiz" isn't...and that is probaby the draw for most schools.


I still don't agree with it.

[soapguy17]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 10:26pm

Switz78(This is answering to your first post), for the most part (I have met MANY exceptions to this rule) there are some subtle differences in the African-American and Caucasian the wiz was written to show off those specific differences. But, it sounds perfectly fine with an all-white cast. As does any musical written for African-American's in mine. A white woman singing "Don't Nobody Being Me No Bad News" is just the same as a black woman singing "Many A New Day". They both sound fine to my ears.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 5/20/07 at 11:29pm

ha. I saw an Asian Millie and a white Muzzy at my brother's high school.

[JulianHookbucks]

Posted: 5/21/07 at 12:04am

the wiz doesn't need black actors. It's an ethnic piece, yes, but the show just needs the heart and soul of the culture the show was written for. Much like Fiddler on the Roof or Oliver. All you need for the Wiz is the ability to tear your heart out soulfully, and you've got a show.