DEAR EVAN HANSEN Movie Musical - News & Discussion Thread- Page 45

[BroadwayNYC2]

Posted: 9/28/21 at 1:21pm

Actually, racism does not go both ways, but you clearly don’t have the vocabulary to have this conversation and I’m not wasting my breath.

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 9/28/21 at 6:09pm

A show so white, part of the main character's redemption involves working at Pottery Barn.

[Platypus]

Posted: 9/28/21 at 8:18pm

Jordan Levinson said: "Which is also why Jared Kleinman became Jared Kalwani - Nik Dodani is of Indian descent and the film absolutely HAD to be more diverse."

Making the cast more diverse is of course a great thing. But the Jared Kleinman character also needed to change because he was a ridiculous Jewish stereotype. If I remember correctly, he makes it clear that he's Jewish by mentioning his Bar Mitzvah money, followed immediately by basically saying that he will do anything for money, then proceeds to help Evan lie. I couldn't believe that a show with so many Jews on the creative team would be reinforcing the old Merchant of Venice trope that Jews are greedy and manipulative.

By leaving out unnecessary mentions of religion and making the character more likeable, as well as making the film more diverse, it was a huge improvement. I wasn't a fan of the movie but that was a positive change. 

 

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 9/28/21 at 10:14pm

BroadwayNYC2 said: "Actually, racism does not go both ways, but you clearly don’t have the vocabulary to have this conversation and I’m not wasting my breath. "

Thank you for reminding me, for I almost wasted mine. For some people, it’s not even worth it.

[rattleNwoolypenguin]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 11:03am

Platypus said: "Jordan Levinson said: "Which is also why Jared Kleinman became Jared Kalwani - Nik Dodani is of Indian descent and the film absolutely HAD to be more diverse."

Making the cast more diverse is of course a great thing. But the Jared Kleinman character also needed to change because he was a ridiculous Jewish stereotype. If I remember correctly,he makes it clear that he's Jewish by mentioning his Bar Mitzvah money, followed immediatelyby basically saying that he will do anything for money, then proceeds to help Evan lie. I couldn't believe that a show with so many Jews on the creative team would be reinforcing the old Merchant of Venicetrope that Jews are greedy and manipulative.

By leaving out unnecessary mentions of religionand making the character more likeable, as well as making the film more diverse, it was a huge improvement. I wasn't afan of the movie but that was a positive change.

"

This is very common I've seen for a long while is jewish musical theatre writers and playwrights making jewish and verging on anti Semitic barbs for on stage humor. I'm never quite sure how to feel about it cause they clearly found it funny themselves but are we supposed to laugh along with the self deprecation? It's odd but it's bizarrely such a staple I've seen and I've always felt like "Well, I guess since the writers are jewish it's okay?" 

Yeah I see it as kinda a neutral territory cause like I said it's just so commonplace. I think it will be interesting to see if new younger jewish writers continue it.

Updated On: 9/29/21 at 11:03 AM

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 12:25pm

It turns out that Connor had a relationship with a male classmate and was in the process of figuring out his “fluid” sexuality; we just never get to see it onstage.

That makes sense, perhaps he hated himself for that or something. On stage we don't ever get to the source of his anger and misery. It would also explain Colton saying "Calm yourself, honey" in "Sincerely Me". Straight dudes don't call other straight dudes honey. It's just not a thing. 

I love it and I wish they would have explored that. 

[joevitus]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 12:30pm

HeyMrMusic said: "BroadwayNYC2 said: "Actually, racism does not go both ways, but you clearly don’t have the vocabulary to have this conversation and I’m not wasting my breath. "

Thank you for reminding me, for I almost wasted mine. For some people, it’s not even worth it."

Racism does not go "both ways" (the language there implying both people in a racist encounter have to be equally hostile to the other on the basis of their race) but anyone of any race can be a racist.

And if you can't watch a show because no one of your race is featured, or you have to mock people for not being of your race, yup, that's some racism you're expressing there.

[HeyMrMusic]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 2:07pm

joevitus said: "HeyMrMusic said: "BroadwayNYC2 said: "Actually, racism does not go both ways, but you clearly don’t have the vocabulary to have this conversation and I’m not wasting my breath. "

Thank you for reminding me, for I almost wasted mine. For some people, it’s not even worth it."

Racism does not go "both ways" (the language there implying both people in a racist encounter have to be equally hostile to the other on the basis of their race)but anyone of any race can be a racist.

And if you can't watch a show because no one of your race is featured, or you have to mock people for not being of your race, yup, that's some racism you'reexpressing there."

Honestly, this attitude is exhausting, and after a year and a half of arguing about it, I'm not the one who has to do the work and the soul-searching here.

[BroadwayNYC2]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 2:47pm

Racism requires marginalization. White people are not and have never been marginalized. So no, the point you think you’re making aint there and you aren’t even close. Shocking I tell you.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 5:11pm

Thank you for reminding me, for I almost wasted mine. For some people, it’s not even worth it.

Agreed. 

[joevitus]

Posted: 9/29/21 at 5:51pm

BroadwayNYC2 said: "Racism requires marginalization. White people are not and have never been marginalized. So no, the point you think you’re making aint there and you aren’t even close. Shocking I tell you."

Nonsense. Do you know Norman Learn's model for Archie Bunker was his Jewish father? Anyone of any race or religion can be a bigot. I've heard Black people disparage Hispanics as a group, Hispanic people disparage Blacks as a group, Jewish people condemn Black people on the basis of race, Black people condemn Jews on the basis of religious bigotry (Jesse Jackson, most famously).

You want to deny an unpleasant truth, but the truth is there. Anyone of any race can be a bigot. 

[Dancingthrulife2]

Posted: 9/30/21 at 2:50pm

REPEATED POSTING.

Updated On: 9/30/21 at 02:50 PM

[Dancingthrulife2]

Posted: 9/30/21 at 2:50pm

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9357050/ratings/?ref_=tt_ov_rt

Interesting stats here. Obviously it's not as popular among the supposed target audience as was expected, at least those who would go on to imdb and rate movies.

[Wayman_Wong]

Posted: 10/2/21 at 11:15pm

Forbes.com on Friday Box Office: 'Dear Evan Hansen' Plunges 78%

Forbes reports this about ''Dear Evan Hansen's'' second weekend at the box office: ''Alas, Dear Evan Hansen is acting like the opposite of The Greatest Showman. The critically savaged musical melodrama earned $730,000 (-78%) on Friday for a $2.4 million (-68%) weekend and miserable $11.75 million 10-day cume. This one won’t get anywhere near its $26 million budget, with a likely domestic finish below $17 million. Here’s hoping it finds some salvation as a PVOD [Premium Video on Demand] title in a couple of weeks.''

Updated On: 10/2/21 at 11:15 PM

[bear88]

Posted: 10/5/21 at 2:59am

This certainly turned out to be a disaster.

Marc Platt may have been trying to turn his son into a movie star but Ben Platt’s career has been damaged. The harm may be temporary, but it’s a career setback for someone who isn’t so established to just shake it off. It’s not just that no one bothered to see the film, because no movie musical has been a financial success this year. (In the Heights will probably lose more money because of its higher budget, but at least a respectable number of people went to see the film and critics liked it, colorism controversy aside.) Dear Evan Hansen was mocked relentlessly, and Platt got a lot of the blame.

The studio and the Platts should have known that critics would be lying in wait for this one, and that first trailer sealed its fate. Plenty of people never liked the story (see this message board) and what worked on Broadway didn’t translate to the big screen.

It didn’t help that the pandemic has left few moviegoers in a terribly adventuresome mood. If they’re going to the movie theater, they want familiar spectacle or genres - comfort food.

Aside from Tick… Tick… Boom, which has no pressure because it’s on Netflix, the only other musical this year is Weat Side Story. I hope that one does well at the box office and with critics, but even if it does, 2021 may mark an end to the short-lived movie musical revival. (West Side Story is a remake of arguably the most famous musical in history, directed by Steven Spielberg. That film is in its own category.)

Or maybe not. Aside from each 2021 movie musicals’ flaws, or lack of widespread commercial appeal, they were being released at a time when moviegoers actively resisted them. I’m just not sure when that changes.

The other question is whether the DEH film’s lack of success will hurt the stage musical and touring productions. Hard to say. Fewer people need to show up to make a stage musical a hit.

Updated On: 10/5/21 at 02:59 AM

[BwayStarlette]

Posted: 10/5/21 at 5:58pm

I'm curious about this, if the savage reviews and poor reception will effect the stage show on Broadway and beyond. Because the reviews are as much about the movie as they are about the storyline and how problematic it is. I heard on I Heart Radio someone describe the whole show was unethical, and that like the creators should be ashamed of themselves. That seemed kinda harsh, but there you go. I love the show but it seems like the movie is making people doubt the show. And now the show also feels really old. It makes me sad, because I saw it 8 times on B'way.

[DAME]

Posted: 10/5/21 at 6:47pm

Any mention anywhere as to when this goes to streaming?  One of the blogs I read was pondering on if it will do like "Respect" and go to on demand soon to try to make some money.  Respect went on VOD two weeks after its release. with no notice. 

[jo]

Posted: 10/5/21 at 11:44pm

bear88 said: "This certainly turned out to be a disaster.
>
>
Plenty of people never liked the story (see this message board) and what worked on Broadway didn’t translate to the big screen.

It didn’t help that the pandemic has left few moviegoers in a terribly adventuresome mood. If they’re going to the movie theater, they want familiar spectacle or genres - comfort food.

Aside from Tick… Tick… Boom,which has no pressure because it’s on Netflix, the only other musical this year is Weat Side Story. I hope that one does well at the box office and with critics, but even if it does, 2021 may mark an end to the short-lived movie musical revival. (West Side Storyis a remake of arguably the most famous musical in history, directed by Steven Spielberg. That film is in its own category.)


Or maybe not. Aside from each 2021 movie musicals’ flaws, or lack of widespread commercial appeal, they were being released at a time when moviegoers actively resisted them. I’m just not sure when that changes.

>
>

*****************

Moviegoers have a lot more choices in terms of genres, including those with serious themes ( like mental health - see  Florian Zeller's The Father). Right or wrong - most look at the musicals genre as more of joyful and life-affirming stories with musical themes.

An original movie musical like The Greatest Showman started flexing its box office muscles by the second weekend after a slow start...and went on to great success at the box office, the album charts (2018 worldwide bestselling album, inclusive of pop music), the sales of home video (running neck to neck to Star Wars)...and even re-screening as sing-along shows or summer open-air screenings. It proved to have universal appeal as the overseas box office ($ 262 M) actually exceeded its domestic take ($ 174 M) - appealing across all ages,  gender and borders... When NYTimes asked its readers why the movie succeeded so well - most of the thousand replies pointed to the joy and warmth the movie and its musical score brought into their lives.

Maybe it is simply the timing of this kind of film adaptations of stage musicals that is the issue - at a time when people are still very weary of the near-dystopian pandemic world, people just want to be cheered and have some slices of happiness even if only inside a movie theatre. 

What about In The Heights - maybe it is the lack of star draws... or maybe it is too focused on only a segment of the population which did not push it towards box office success?  What about the new Spielberg West Side Story -- it is not really a genre that is among Spielberg's major film successes -- but it does have a musical score that is familiar to a number from way back. Will those still appeal? We'll see.

Hope both original film musicals and film adaptations of stage musicals continue to have a life among film choices of moviegoers!
 

Updated On: 10/6/21 at 11:44 PM

[BJR]

Posted: 10/6/21 at 7:30am

Genuinely liked it better than most here.

Main complaint would be the slow pacing/adaptation led to sometimes up to 10-15 minutes between numbers, which is too long, but sometimes happens in movie adaptations where they're opening things up.

But many of the things that bothered others were fine to me. I could never have told you Ben's age if I didn't know it, but also couldn't have told you anyone else's.

[Rainah]

Posted: 10/6/21 at 9:38am

BwayStarlette said: "I'm curious about this, if the savage reviews and poor reception will effect the stage show on Broadway and beyond."

Too early to say overall, but based on reports they weren't selling well at the Flea compared to other hit shows. People haggling down the price on an opening night hat, buying a cast for $50... didn't see that in previous years. Meanwhile, Hadestown upped their prices from the last Flea.

But that's such a crazy small segment it's hard to generalize it to the stage show. And likely impossible to say what effect is from the movie and what is from the pandemic hurting all ticket sales.

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 10/6/21 at 11:06am

I think the bloom is off the rose on this property. It really needs to stop touting itself as being "feel good" or even being a positive piece on mental illness. It is so shoddily written, offensive at times, and bungles any possibility of that. The wheels have fallen off this wagon. It can contain some really great pop tunes but if everything surrounding those is offensive garbage, it starts to stink. 

This original stage property was a a happening, a zeitgeist moment where someone delivered a remarkable performance. It was thing to behold and see those songs sung by Ben live. It elevated the questionable book. 

I have real doubts this will ever be revived on Broadway or a tour despite its initial popularity. I don't think anyone will touch it or be interested. I do however think schools will do this due to casting opportunities for high school and university students regardless of how grotesque its messaging is. It's a great showcase for talent. 

[rattleNwoolypenguin]

Posted: 10/6/21 at 1:16pm

Yeah I really agree that what made it so spectacular in its moment was that raw emotional truth coming from Ben and Rachel Bay Jones in a proscenium musical. Ben Platt's range in his performance was really unforgettable and no question stands out as one of the best we have ever seen on Broadway.

I think the show has been able to coast on THAT being the reason to see it, by continuing to recast it well enough so it's able to still be moving for that reason.

With the AMOUNT of vitriol the movie got, and the fact our world is reeling from a pandemic,

yeah honestly who is going to go see this anymore?

People REALLY had no idea what the premise of this show was. And when they found out a lot of them it was an instant turnoff

Updated On: 10/6/21 at 01:16 PM

[Wayman_Wong]

Posted: 10/7/21 at 9:58pm

'Dear Evan Hansen': What the Media Gets Wrong About Mental Heath

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mFf_CEyyAgg

[ClumsyDude15]

Posted: 10/8/21 at 2:23pm

I think the show won't see much of an impact especially since it definitely seems like they made the conscious effort to keep them as two separate entitles. There was never any mention of the movie on any of the show's social media accounts and the movie had it's own accounts. 

The show already recouped awhile ago, the show is very small and fairly cheap to run.

As someone who actually really loved the movie, I'm even more excited to get to see the show in person again (I have tickets for Broadway reopening night, tickets to the Philly stop of the tour next summer. and plans to see the tour in another city or two over the next year.). As someone at one point in this thread pointed out, there's nothing that compares to seeing the show on stage and really feeling the emotions of it all.    

Updated On: 10/8/21 at 02:23 PM

[DEHFanatic]

Posted: 10/14/21 at 8:19pm

The movie is now streaming on demand starting tomorrow (though apparently on Vudu today):

https://www.dehmovie.com/

Updated On: 10/14/21 at 08:19 PM