Musical masterpieces

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Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 6:37pm

Hey everyone! A friend and I were discussing this yesterday and now I was wondering, what musicals do you consider to be masterpieces? I'd have to say that Ragtime is a near, if not perfect musical.

Ragtime is a great but IMHO flawed musical. While parts may seem old fashioned now, I think Show Boat pretty much meets the description. The King and I out of all of R&H's brilliant musicals does for me as well. And Guys and Dolls.

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 6:41pm

Ragtime for sure. I would also include Sweeney Todd, Gypsy, and Into the Woods.

"There’s nothing quite like the power and the passion of Broadway music. "

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 6:53pm

Follies is what I consider to be the perfect musical. The score is breathtaking, the book is brilliant, and Dorothy Collins was a revelation as Sally. When she sings "Losing My Mind" I literally cry.

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 6:54pm

Let's not be cavalier with the use of the word "masterpiece."

Shakespeare wrote masterpieces. Mozart wrote masterpieces. Rembrandt painted masterpieces.

Musicals? I don't know if even the greatest among them merits that term, but if any do, I guess they would be Show Boat, Oklahoma!, and My Fair Lady.

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 7:07pm

She Loves Me

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:18pm

Gypsy
1776
Sweeney Todd

"It does me no injury for my neighbour to say there are 20 gods or no god. It neither picks my pocket, nor breaks my leg." -- Thomas Jefferson

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:21pm

I consider Follies to be a perfect musical. Ragtime also comes close for me.

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:23pm

I'm with After Eight on this one. VERY VERY VERY few shows could reach that standard. I'm sure this thread will turn into an I-Love-Sondheim masturbation thread with fanboys saying that each and every show he did is the be all end all of music. A MUSICAL masterpiece needs to transcend a single stars performance or one production of a show. The SHOW needs to transcend cheep sets, and lack luster direction and a less then stellar cast to still be able to work. It's about the libretto and music.

1) Showboat. Hands down a masterpiece that has lasted almost 100 years and is only getting richer with time

2) Sweeney Todd- a show that can be done on a shoestring and still work it's power and might.

3) My Fair Lady- The balance of libretto and music has never been more perfect

Others-
Oklahoma! (While not a favorite of mine I can see where it is a masterpiece )
The Fantastics - Yes I would put this on the list as a masterpiece
West Side Story
1776
I'm thinking of Hello Dolly! as well

(While the Follies fans will say that it is ..we all know it's not ...It's a cult masterpiece if there ever was one, much like Rocky Horror and Carrie. )

Updated On: 6/2/13 at 08:23 PM

#10

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:31pm

A Little Night Music

#11

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:39pm

Everyone mentioned most of my main choices already..
Ragtime, She Loves Me, 1776, South Pacific...maybe Music Man.

Gypsy is close.

#12

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 8:45pm

The Sound of Music, for sure. (Though I may or may not be disregarding 'Ordinary Couple'...)

#13

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 9:27pm

Gypsy
West Side Story
A Little Night Music
Sweeney Todd
1776
The Music Man
The Light In the Piazza
A Chorus Line
Oklahoma!
Show Boat
Guys and Dolls
Kiss Me, Kate

Some flaws, but awful close ...

Ragtime
Grey Gardens
South Pacific
Carousel
Hello, Dolly!
The Drowsy Chaperone
Rent
Chicago

"Jaws is the Citizen Kane of movies."

blocked: logan2, Diamonds3, Hamilton22

#14

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 9:34pm

Cabaret

#15

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 9:41pm

SHOW BOAT
OKLAHOMA!
GUYS AND DOLLS
GYPSY

#16

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 9:50pm

I agree about not using "masterpiece" to describe many...
but I will agree with those here who list

SHOW BOAT

Nothing really compares in terms of what I think of as a "masterpiece".

I would also include the opera of PORGY AND BESS (if that counts).

THE KING AND I ... nearly

Other close-to-masterpieces:

SOUTH PACIFIC
A LITTLE NIGHT MUSIC
THE LIGHT IN THE PIAZZA

And for the controversial choice:

THE SCOTTSBORO BOYS ..... The first time I saw it, I said it was a masterpiece and I haven't changed my mind. Though, I think that Stroman's staging is included in the "masterpiece" status, and I cannot imagine seeing it with someone else's staging...

#17

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 9:58pm

A few no-one has mentioned that I think qualify:

CAROUSEL
BRIGADOON
FINIAN'S RAINBOW
THE THREEPENNY OPERA
CANDIDE
FIDDLER ON THE ROOF
PACIFIC OVERTURES
SUNDAY IN THE PARK WITH GEORGE
BILLY ELLIOTT

A masterpiece does NOT have to be a perfect work of art for me, just one that will stand the test of time as great theater literature.

#18

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 10:17pm

After Eight is absolutely correct... Many of those mentioned here still fall short of "masterpiece" for me, and I'm not entirely certain I'm ever fully comfortable using that word at all. MY FAIR LADY leapt to mind immediately, WEST SIDE STORY followed. That both followed works by prior acknowledged masters (Shaw and Shakespeare) perhaps is why I feel most comfortable elevating them. Or maybe that's just me finding a pretentious excuse to theorize.

Words don't deserve that kind of malarkey. They're innocent, neutral, precise, standing for this, describing that, meaning the other, so if you look after them you can build bridges across incomprehension and chaos. But when they get their corners knocked off, they're no good anymore…I don't think writers are sacred, but words are. They deserve respect. If you get the right ones in the right order, you can nudge the world a little.

#19

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 10:49pm

Sweeney Todd is the only musical I know that I'd describe as a masterpiece. Almost every line, every note, every lyric is perfect. It works with 2 synths or an 80-piece orchestra, with people who are strong singers or people who can barely sing. It hasn't aged a day. It's the only musical that is genuinely thrilling, it appeals to everyone.

Give me claws and a hunch, just away from this bunch.

#20

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 11:11pm

Best12's list. Except perhaps remove 1776 and Rent and move Carousel and South Pacific from "awful close" to the top list and add She Loves Me to "awful close." I'll bet he agrees that both lists are impossible to be definitive or without consideration to how one feels at the moment. And maybe My Fair Lady should be in there somewhere. Maybe.

Updated On: 6/2/13 at 11:11 PM

#21

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 11:14pm

Sweeney Todd
Follies
The Light In The Piazza
Carousel
Ragtime
My Fair Lady
A Chorus Line

"I saw Pavarotti play Rodolfo on stage and with his girth I thought he was about to eat the whole table at the Cafe Momus." - Dollypop

#22

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/2/13 at 11:20pm

The Book of Mormon

#23

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/3/13 at 12:01am

"Sweeney Todd...It's the only musical that is genuinely thrilling, it appeals to everyone."

No it doesn't, not by a long shot. I know plenty of people who can't stand it, and I positively loathe it.

#24

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/3/13 at 2:00am

Whether you personally "loathe" the show is not what is being discussed. Many music and theatre critics cite SWEENEY TODD as Sondheim's masterpiece..his PORGY AND BESS.

However you are correct to note that it is not universally adored. In the original run a feature story about Angela Lansbury noted that getting people into the thetare to see this show was a huge challenge. While many did end up loving it, others were put ff by the violence, the jolting factory whistle and the broad performances. Many people left at intermission. The awards, the critical acclaim and snobbish attitude that anyone who didn't like the show was not culturally connected.

For me it was a genuinely thrilling show, but one that does not appeal to everyone. Even so, I believe it has earned it's place on the list of modern musical masterpieces. Along with SHOW BOAT, PORGY AND BESS, OKLAHOMA!, GUYS AND DOLLS, MY FAIR LADY, WEST SIDE STORY, and GYPSY. Each of these shows has flaws, but they stand up beautifully to repeated viewings and that is a crucial criteria for a "masterpiece."

Cast albums are NOT "soundtracks."
Live theatre does not use a "soundtrack." If it did, it wouldn't be live theatre!

I host a weekly one-hour radio program featuring cast album selections as well as songs by cabaret, jazz and theatre artists. The program, FRONT ROW CENTRE is heard Sundays 9 to 10 am and also Saturdays from 8 to 9 am (eastern times) on www.proudfm.com

#25

Musical masterpieces

Posted: 6/3/13 at 2:35am

Showboat- HANDS DOWN, not only because it is the first of the "modern musical" but because it is bold, groundbreaking, and the book/score alone can be read/listened to like a book/symphony

Cabaret- I think any show that can be interpreted so differently and create such diverse emotions with a single concept justifies itself as a masterpiece. Selected songs alone from Cabaret could be masterpieces, but what really solidifies it are the complexities of the characters. It's a musical whose storyline is about events caused by characters, rather than characters reacting to events. Every scene, line, song, character is interesting.

A Chorus Line- Again; groundbreaking, uncharted, thrilling, and a stand alone concept. Not to mention it is the masterpiece of the great Michael Bennett whose choreography will ALWAYS be attributed to this show. Elements from this show are so stylized and specific you can see a gold hat and automatically attribute it to A Chorus Line.

Carousel- I don't care what anyone says, this IS the best R&H. It's their most groundbreaking (sensing a theme) emotional, mature, realistic (even with the whole Star-Keeper randomness), blunt, and creative work. NOTHING compares to the score in this show.

Sondheim is good but his shows only last to the end of first act. They are all separate entities. Is he the greatest composer of contemporary theatre, yes. Do his SHOWS (not the songs) create a complete thought or clear concept, that's where it gets muddy. Sweeney and A Little Night Music are probably the closest to establishing a full narrative, but there is something uncomfortable about them that doesn't lend themselves to being a Masterpiece.

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