Posted: 8/19/20 at 4:41am
Aren’t Millennials old now? I think they would have passed the baton on to Gen Z or whoever by now.
Updated On: 8/19/20 at 04:41 AM
Posted: 8/19/20 at 9:12am
I think Gen Z is chiller, but that just might be a fantasy I've created in my head. Millennials are in their 20's/30s. Not really old unless we're using Jeffrey Epstein metrics.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 9:24am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 10:05am
LizzieCurry said: "Meanwhile, someone on All That Chat is saying this is a right-wing takedown. LOL.
https://www.talkinbroadway.com/allthatchat_new/d.php?id=2495163"
That's Michael Portontiere whose misogyny is well known to those of us who listen(ed) to him on BroadwayRadio.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 10:17am
I don't understand people who are like "I'm not offended and I only care about current behavior" but then use their so called better spent energy to defend people that they agree said messed up things. Like if you made up your mind to not care then why not just... move along? Simply digging up a person's old tweets (and there are a lot in this bunch) shouldn't be a problem. Broadwayworld and Rainbow's fans have a choice in ignoring the tweets or waiting for Rainbow's acknowledgment. If it doesn't offend you, yet you still think the tweets are bad, then why spend energy defending him when the onus is on everyone else to figure out their feelings/actions?
There's a very pervasive "well, this allegation/action could ruin his reputation!" attitude rather than a "well if he DID it then let people decide whether there should be consequences."
Posted: 8/19/20 at 10:19am
I think there's a middle ground to the 2 extremes being posited here (full cancellation vs. full exoneration). especially when it's connected to events from many years earlier.
Should someone held accountable for things they said 10 years ago? Absolutely. Do they deserve to be de-platformed over it? I say that depends on what he does now. He is aware now that people have found these tweets and that they take offense to them. If he were to respond to them, making it very clear that he no longer believes this sort of comedy is appropriate, and that he has actually grown and learned in the past 8-10 years - If he makes sincere attempts to show that he has changed his behavior, then that's important. That's what Kevin Hart did, which is why I don't necessary think he deserved to be cancelled.
If he sticks to his guns and/or stays silent, then the "it was 10 years ago" defense loses all credibility, because at this point he is now making the choice to deflect accountability for his past actions. And that choice is being made in 2020, not 2010.
But even if he does go the high route of apologizing, I still think it's important that people be aware of the kinds of things he has said and done in the past. I just don't think he necessarily deserves to lose his career over it.
In case it matters, for the record: I've never watched a single Randy Rainbow video. I could not care less about him as an audience member. I'm not saying any of this to defend him or excuse his actions. This is just how I generally feel about these kinds of situations.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 10:48am
I think this is where we get in a really tricky spot with "cancel culture" sometimes. Not even specifically looking at this example, but in general when something like this happens. On the one hand, yes, people absolutely need to be held accountable for things they said that were inappropriate in the past or jokes they made that they thought were acceptable then but now realize were cruel and offensive. But at the same point, if we continue to "cancel" people because of mistakes like these that were made a decade ago, even if the person has "reformed" now and recognized their errors, then why should anyone learn from their mistakes? Isn't the point that we want people who are or were racist, sexist, homophobic, etc. to learn from the error of their ways and recognize their flaws and become better people? And by saying that no matter what you've learned and what you've done since you made an inappropriate joke or comment years ago doesn't matter and you still need to be cancelled anyway, then why should anyone who once made a joke like that even try to get better, knowing it's meaningless and that they're already permanently vilified for it no matter what they do now?
Now, in this particular case, Randy Rainbow's silence on this matter so far is a little suspicious and I'm not at all yet convinced that he has learned from his mistakes and that he does recognize these were terrible and inappropriate things to say. But this is just a more general point, that don't we want people to learn from their past? I mean, if not, then what are we all actually working towards?
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:00am
I enjoy the very dark shock humor in those posts. However, there is a definite time and place for humor like that. In the sober light of day, as this thread has demonstrated, the humor in these posts is not acceptable by today's society, which is a good thing. However, a drunken group of friends being silly at 2am when all/most of society's norms don't have to be enforced, these posts could work.
That said, seeing people in this thread getting worked up about these posts makes them even more effective in terms of dark humor.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:03am
ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "Whether you think this is okay or not, this is the kind of thing that got James Gunn fired from Guardians of the Galaxy and lost Kevin Hart his Oscar hosting gig. His career isnowhere near the level of those people, but if I was thinking of hiring him for something I'd think twice now.
I'm sure Woke Twitter (who already dislikes RR)will have a field day in 3...2..."
Actually Hart lost the gig because he didn't want it. So that's that.
Also, this is about accountability. It's not about being woke. The problem is that people are tweeting the same crap in 2020 and you know that in 2024 people will look back and make the same "but that was in 2020 and happened 4 years ago" excuse. We can no longer keep making these excuses. 2010 was not that long ago. So, that means when was it not long ago that it was ok to be racist? Was it only now you can't be? So any tweet from 2020 and on should be punishable. You people and your excuses for hate is gross.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:06am
I don't see that there's necessarily a rush to "cancel" him anyway, and even just using the phrase gives credence to the concept of "cancel culture" — which I don't think is really as significant or real a thing as people say it is (it's more like, a celeb's past transgressions have been revealed, many don't like it, there's fallout, etc.). After all, many folks have bounced back from being so-called canceled if they're a white dude.
But yes, it is weird that he hasn't said anything. A lot of us have grown and learned from whatever kind of person we were in 2010. I was also on twitter back then and probably tweeted some things that 2020 me would cringe at. It seems that not once did Randy Rainbow think, "Hey, celebrities are retweeting me, so maybe I should clean a few things up! There are always people who don't like others' work and will do oppo research on them!"
2010 Twitter was a more closed-off space, more faddy, more stream-of-consciousness than it is now. The more a public figure acknowledges that (especially one who got big 4-5 years later), the better off they'll be. Maybe/probably.
Updated On: 8/19/20 at 11:06 AM
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:10am
Broadway61004 said: "Now, in this particular case, Randy Rainbow's silence on this matter so far is a little suspicious and I'm not at all yet convinced that he has learned from his mistakes and that he does recognize these were terrible and inappropriate things to say. But this is just a more general point, that don't we want people to learn from their past? I mean, if not, then what are we all actually working towards?"
I agree with you but actually he has not been silent; he has one item above post-controversy, and it makes clear that he has yet to learn anything. And BWW has also been silent except that it is business as usual in terms of the links to his content.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:11am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:13am
Sending his loyal followers after his detractors via retweet certainly isn't helping.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:16am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:19am
You can still view his timeline, though, right? (Not sarcastic; I wasn't sure if there's some kind of overlay or pop-up that appears for non-users.)
Edited to add: LOL https://twitter.com/ira/status/1295885429468573699
Updated On: 8/19/20 at 11:19 AM
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:22am
klinnerz said: "Also, this is about accountability. It's not about being woke. The problem is that people are tweeting the same crap in 2020 and you know that in 2024 people will look back and make the same "but that was in 2020 and happened 4 years ago" excuse. We can no longer keep making these excuses. 2010 was not that long ago. So, that means when was it not long ago that it was ok to be racist? Was it only now you can't be? So any tweet from 2020 and on should be punishable. You people and your excuses for hate is gross."
I agree that "it was 10 years ago" shouldn't be an excuse if the intention is to say "it was ok to be racist in 2010." But I do think it can be used to say "people can change, learn, and grow a lot in the span of 10 years." But as I, and others, have said, that line of thinking requires him to take accountability now, in 2020. It isn't, and shouldn't be a free pass.
And I agree with Jordan that he should be given a bit of time to reflect inwardly and process things before being required to make a statement on the subject. But if he's given that time, and doesn't take accountability, that's revealing of his true colors. And as Hogan said, his initial response is not encouraging.
I also agree with Lizzie that people (including myself, sometimes) are too quick to throw around the term "cancelled" and "cancel culture." A lot of the time, a celebrity does sometime wrong, and they receive calls for accountability, criticism, and backlash. But people mistakenly lump all of those things under the label "cancel culture" which just isn't accurate.
Updated On: 8/19/20 at 11:22 AM
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:23am
This highly transphobic tweet is only 4 years old (for people who are using the 10 year defense).
https://twitter.com/RandyRainbow/status/734796296280768512
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:25am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:47am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:48am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 11:54am
Posted: 8/19/20 at 12:00pm
Why would he Streisand-effect the situation and respond? To appease a couple people complaining on Twitter & a Broadway message board?
Posted: 8/19/20 at 12:01pm
Thoughts on these:
1. I don't know who Randy Rainbow is. Don't care.
2. The Rihanna joke made me laugh and I'm probably going to hell for that. But it's not racist.
3. The rest of these jokes are not funny (with one exception. See below). I'm not sure why he posted that "Chinese in the fridge" joke a second time when it wasn't funny the first time.
4. There are racist jokes and there are "racist" jokes. Racist jokes are not funny, because they're racist. "Racist" jokes can be funny because they're about racism itself. The cat joke is a good example of that, and I thought it was pretty funny. The rest of these jokes sound like they're trying to be the latter but unfortunately come off like the former. Context and source are important, and here there is no context (because they're just random tweets) and the source is a guy I don't know, so they're just isolated "edgy" jokes with ambiguous intent behind them.
5. If you're legitimately hurt or upset by these jokes (not "offended" because that's meaningless), the solution is to contact this guy and let him know how you feel and why. If you're just abstractly "offended" by them because you feel like you're supposed to be, the solution is to not follow Randy Rainbow's Twitter and move on because he's clearly not for you. But don't make it his problem.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 12:04pm
Amazing to be a member of this board long enough to post and somehow miss him showing up in a sidebar every other day.
Posted: 8/19/20 at 12:06pm
Because the Internet is not compartmentalized and, by the very nature of what he does, he is drawing and inviting attention to himself and therefore any sustained discussion of these tweets... and he's targeting a liberal audience that is sensitive to issues like this. He's a niche figure at best, which means stuff like this has the potential to hurt a lot if left unchecked.
The bulk of the tweets are old enough that any sort of acknowledgment and apology and statement of change would probably satisfy most people and the thing is nipped in the bud and he can do his next music parody about the DNC or whatever.
Updated On: 8/19/20 at 12:06 PM
