THE DEVIL WEARS PRADA Musical - News & Discussion Thread- Page 8

[InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:23pm

Sutton Ross said: "(ala Pretty Women/Mean Girls/Mrs Doubtfire/Tootsie/I could go on forever). When will producers realize that audiences don't want this?

Mean Girls recouped and was very popular on Broadway so it seems audiences did want that."

It recovered it's capitalization and then closed forever with the pandemic because they knew they had a terrible advance for Spring 2020/Summer 2020 before the pandemic happened.  And, if I'm remembering correctly, it was critically lampooned.  But I admit I was wrong, it did recoup!  I'll call it a draw on Mean Girls lol 

 

[HenryTDobson]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:24pm

I'm surprised to hear that they kept a lot of the dialogue from the movie. Yes, some of it is iconic, but much less so than other movie-to-musicals (I'm thinking Mean Girls). I don't think anyone would be missing huge chunks of dialogue (save for several key points).

When will writers/producers learn? How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?  

[songanddanceman2]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:27pm

I agree Sutton. Also, Mean Girls didn't get bad reviews, it got mixed.

As for The Devil Wears Prada, I could see this coming a mile away. I knew they would suffer the Miranda problem (even though that's actually a pretty easy fix if they used their imagination) and Elton was never right for this. 

[InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:29pm

HenryTDobson said: "How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?"

It's the same reason you'll never go on a new ride at Disney World again that isn't based on a movie Disney owns:

The entertainment world is run by known IPs now.  And it's very lame.  There is no room for anything new to be created because everything has to be attached to/based on/a sequel to/a remake of/a musical of a movie that's already made 200 million at the box office.  Horrific times for actual creatives trying to make a living. 

There's no room for someone writing like Sondheim on Broadway because when they're going to announce the straight play about the Joker that's coming to Broadway (and I'm not being satirical, that’s coming probably fall 2024 lmao).  Everything is all IP now.   

 

Updated On: 7/21/22 at 01:29 PM

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:35pm

Anna D. Shapiro was such a great choice for Director on paper, but perhaps a big splashy musical is just not for her. She should stick to plays and dramas. Also, I wonder what the tea is with Paul Rudnick leaving the writing team; It seems like Kate Wetherhead wasn’t prepared to take on this material alone.

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:38pm

Ravenclaw said: "Anna Shapiro is one of our great directors, but her work has been almost exclusively in new plays. But the same could be said of her colleague and friend David Cromer, who absolutely hit it out of the park on his first major musical. Cromer brought a fresh voice to the table and pushed the piece to play in a style that was unusual and fresh for the musical theatre. Right now, Shapiro's work lacks the specificity you expect from her and belies a lack of understanding of the musical theatre craft.But Cromer was surrounded by skilled Broadway regulars, whereas Shapiro has a first-time book writer, a first-time musical theatre choreographer, and a composer reachable only by phone as he finishes his farewell tour.

Near the end of the first act, Andy's friends sing a (not very good) trio about missing their old friend. All three stand on a basically bare stage. Then a big red curtain comes down and we're on the red carpet awaiting Miranda's arrival. Andy and Emily deliver filler dialogue as guests arrive and pose for pictures. The whole scene goes on way too long until Miranda finally shows up, strikes a pose, and the curtain lifts to reveal a giant red staircase and you realize that scene must have been written to cover the set change. Why didn't the previous song take place downstage of the curtain? Then you wouldn't need the filler dialogue and could lift the curtain to reveal the new set, putting us on the red carpet. There are so many frustrating little things like this that should be no-brainers, but a director who does one-room realistic dramas doesn't normally have to think about.

But I don't think Anna Shapiro needs to be replaced--I think she has a strong point of view on the piece, and she's shepherded new work through a rocky preview period to great success before. Anyone remember the complete turnaround she pulled off onMotherf****er with the Hat? We all thought that was dead in the water and then it transformed into a complete knockout during a four week preview period. She's a good enough director to understand what's not working about the story and the central relationships, and that's what the focus needs to be focusing on right now. A Susan Stroman or a Jerry Zaks or a Kathleen Marshall could come in and give attention to the pieces of craft that are eluding the team right now.

The same thing goes for the book. Weatherhead is a talented writer, she clearly understands the characters well and writes some good lines--many of her jokes stand up well next to the bits that are verbatim from the screenplay. She transitions in and out of songs smoothly, and she conveys the beats of the story and character motivations clearly. Most first-time book writers of musicals don't accomplish all of that very well. But, as others have pointed out, many major crises and moments of transformation happen offstage or are rushed through, and we spend far too much time with the friends and too little time is devoted to Miranda and the demands she puts on Andy. What should be a story about a woman who hardens herself in order to survive a cold and unfeeling world and in doing so realizes she is making herself cold and unfeeling instead is just a simple story about a smart girl who learns not to look down upon the world of fashion. But this can be fixed and re-tooled so that the focus is in the right place, so that we invest in the right relationships and the stakes are made clear.

What's going to be harder to fix is the score. It's the weakest score of the five musicals Elton John has written (evenLestathad a couple good tunes!), and the lyrics don't salvage much it. The songs all sound like, well, second-rate Elton John. There's little effort to differentiate the sounds of the different characters (other than the harpsichord sounds underneath Miranda's songs). As another poster mentioned, the lyrics rarely delve beneath the surface of a character bluntly stating what they're feeling and then repeating that idea for three minutes. I don't know that these problems can be fixed, short of throwing out all the songs and starting over.

But the fact that the songs never move the story forward--that can be fixed more easily. Early on (and forgive me if I'm not getting the details perfectly correct, as I have only seen the show once), Miranda interviews Andy, she answers a few questions, then Miranda goes into a song about Andy's life plan. The song concludes, we clap, the dialogue resumes, Miranda implies that Andy isn't the right girl for the job, Andy makes her pitch and leaves, defeated, only to quickly be offered the job. We are at the same place at the end of the song as we were at the beginning, the song just wastes our time. They could give Andy a verse to pitch herself through song, or Miranda could sing an extra verse after Andy leaves giving us insight into why she chooses to hire Andy, or the song could end with Andy being offered the job, or the song could end with Miranda saying that Andy will not have the job, or some combination of these things, just anything that leaves us in a different place story-wise and emotion-wise than where we started the song. Take the above and apply it to every song in the show, ask "what is different between the beginning of the song and the end of the song?" and then we'll have a real musical. Right now, Andy makes the decision to quit at the beginning of her 11-o'clock number and then sings to us about how she's changed for three minutes instead of contemplating what to do and making her choice at the climax of the song. These are the things that are weighing the show down at this moment.

That was all a little rambly, and I hope no one takes this as my unsolicited show-doctoring, but rather a personal take on what I saw last night, and where I hope the show will go from here. Others may interpret these moments and the problems with the show differently than I do, and I look forward to hearing what others think and how the show evolves. There are a lot of smart, talented people working on this show, and I do believe there is potential to turn it around, if the team really takes the opportunity to learn from this tryout.

And to those who are saying "bring in Jerry Mitchell," while I think he's very talented, much of what is wrong with this show right now is what was wrong withPretty Woman, and that show sure didn't get fixed in time for Broadway."

I do agree that Pretty Woman is the worst show I’ve seen on Broadway. 
 

Id argue though that A Band’s Visit is/was basically a small play so it’s up his wheelhouse. This is def a big splashy new musical. Different territories. 

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 1:44pm

The entertainment world is run by known IPs now.  And it's very lame.  There is no room for anything new to be created because everything has to be attached to/based on/a sequel to/a remake of/a musical of a movie that's already made 200 million at the box office.  Horrific times for actual creatives trying to make a living. 

There's no room for someone writing like Sondheim on Broadway because when they're going to announce the straight play about the Joker that's coming to Broadway (and I'm not being satirical, that’s coming probably fall 2024 lmao).  Everything is all IP now. 

Great comments, it is truly lame and depressing. Sigh. 

[Three's Company]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 2:10pm

InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "HenryTDobson said: "How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?"

It's the same reason you'll never go on a new ride at Disney World again that isn't based on a movie Disney owns:

The entertainment world is run by known IPs now. And it's very lame. There is no room for anything new to be created because everything has to be attached to/based on/a sequel to/a remake of/a musical of a movie that's already made 200 million at the box office. Horrific times for actual creatives trying to make a living.

There's no room for someone writing like Sondheim on Broadway because when they're going to announce the straight play about the Joker that's coming to Broadway (and I'm not being satirical, that’s coming probably fall 2024 lmao). Everything is all IP now.

"

The only way to justify the cost of a big budget musical is with mammoth ticket prices. The only people who are willing to pay mammoth ticket prices outright are tourists/folks on vacation. In order to justify spending that much on mammoth ticket prices, audiences need to know (to an extent) that they're going to get something they like out of a show. It sort of writes itself. I don't know how much this cost to produce, but other big budget musicals in this sphere tend to be 20–25 million these days. I remember a number of years ago it was 8-10 million
 
I think I read somewhere that the producer of this show has a deal with 20th Century Fox to pull items from their catalog, so I don't think this is going away anytime soon. 

All that said, I'm not totally against movie to musical adaptions. Shows like Newsies, Heathers, Legally Blonde, Waitress all breathed new life into their source material and stand on their own. But I do think it takes particular vision to do it right and it's disappointing when it's the only thing in the landscape.

Updated On: 7/21/22 at 02:10 PM

[JasonC3]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 3:17pm

InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "Everything is all IP now."

I get your apparent frustration, but this is a sweeping generalization.

And Broadway musicals have been adaptations or based on books, movies, and plays for decades, including Sondheim.

 

[Ravenclaw]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 3:47pm

JasonC3 said: "InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "Everything is all IP now."

I get your apparent frustration, but this is a sweeping generalization.

And Broadway musicals have been adaptations or based on books, movies, and plays for decades, including Sondheim."

Yes, but the pre-packaging of known quantities to squeeze more money out of back catalogue titles is new. This musical exists because 20th Century Fox made a deal with Kevin McCollum to develop musicals based on their popular properties. Nobody approached Sondheim about adapting an Ettore Scola film, and that property did not guarantee huge advance sales. In the golden age, musicals based on famous properties tried to actively distance themselves from their source materials, and so we have My Fair Lady and Hello, Dolly instead of Pygmalion, the Musical! and The Matchmaker, the Musical! 

[RippedMan]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 4:31pm

InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "HenryTDobson said: "How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?"

It's the same reason you'll never go on a new ride at Disney World again that isn't based on a movie Disney owns:

The entertainment world is run by known IPs now. And it's very lame. There is no room for anything new to be created because everything has to be attached to/based on/a sequel to/a remake of/a musical of a movie that's already made 200 million at the box office. Horrific times for actual creatives trying to make a living.

There's no room for someone writing like Sondheim on Broadway because when they're going to announce the straight play about the Joker that's coming to Broadway (and I'm not being satirical, that’s coming probably fall 2024 lmao). Everything is all IP now.

"

Which is so interesting to me is that the hits of the past few seasons (Fun Home, A Band's Visit, Hamilton, Waitress (I know it's a movie, but it wasn't super well known), heck, even Spelling Bee. Those were all original musicals or at least based on source material not widely known where as all the movie musicals have flopped. So you'd think that audiences DO want something new and exciting. 

[JeaniusIsMe]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 4:31pm

HenryTDobson said: "I'm surprised to hear that they kept a lot of the dialogue from the movie. Yes, some of it is iconic, but much less so than other movie-to-musicals (I'm thinking Mean Girls). I don't think anyone would be missing huge chunks of dialogue (save for several key points).

When will writers/producers learn? How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?"

I will say - some of the biggest cheers/laughs/engagement from the crowd came from the lines from the film. Similar to when I saw Mean Girls in that regard. But my god yes, I'm so with you on stopping this movie to musical trend. I'm dreading the pre-Broadway version of The Notebook that I'm seeing at Chicago Shakes in September...

 

[HenryTDobson]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 4:45pm

Which is so interesting to me is that the hits of the past few seasons (Fun Home, A Band's Visit, Hamilton, Waitress (I know it's a movie, but it wasn't super well known), heck, even Spelling Bee. Those were all original musicals or at least based on source material not widely known where as all the movie musicals have flopped. So you'd think that audiences DO want something new and exciting. 

Absolutely. And I don't mean to say all movie-to-musicals should stop being made - of course not! But creatives should be really focusing in on the material and deciding if the story can be moved forward through song. Less known films (Kinky Boots, Waitress, Band's Visit, etc.) find more success because there's less expectations and they all were adjusted to fit the musical theater mode better. 

[HenryTDobson]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 4:49pm

JeaniusIsMe said: "HenryTDobson said: "I'm surprised to hear that they kept a lot of the dialogue from the movie. Yes, some of it is iconic, but much less so than other movie-to-musicals (I'm thinking Mean Girls). I don't think anyone would be missing huge chunks of dialogue (save for several key points).

When will writers/producers learn? How many bad movie-to-musicals do we need before they realize not ALL movies need to be musicalized?"

I will say - some of the biggest cheers/laughs/engagement from the crowd came from the lines from the film. Similar to when I saw Mean Girls in that regard. But my god yes, I'm so with you on stopping this movie to musical trend. I'm dreading the pre-Broadway version of The Notebook that I'm seeing at Chicago Shakes in September...
 

I'm not surprised to hear that the audience was reactive to lines they knew well. My point was more that there are less lines and moments in DWP that are truly iconic and need replicating. If anything, incorporate maybe 15% of the lines from the movie script - the impact for these lines will then be stronger and make the audience even more excited for those little blips. Everything else can then be original, providing more opportunities for a better structure of the show. 

 

[Marlothom]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 4:56pm

On Tuesday's performance, they literally had an ensemble member walk in to Miranda's office in a floral dress, just so she can say "florals for Spring? Riveting"  - -- and quickly exit SL. 

[KJisgroovy]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 5:15pm

It gets under my skin when people complain about movie adaptations. Anything can be the source of a good musical. Anything. The problem is less the source and more the creative team. You have to fully adapt the material to the new format. I think some folks are correct in pointing out the more "well known" a property is... the more the creative team might feel beholden to giving the audience what they're expecting. Adding songs to a script that works much better without them without much else. There's a nuance that gets lost in the complaints about movie adaptations that I think mistakes what the actual problem is. 

To be fair, many people in this thread have already articulated my points much better than I have. But. I thought it was interesting that someone in this thread complained about movie retreads while also naming a few movie adaptations as examples of successes. 

[RippedMan]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 7:32pm

I think Kinky Boots is a fantastic example. A little known movie that has found great success - we just had it at the Hollywood Bowl and now it's opening Off -Broadway. I don't think tourists/audiences are that dumb. I can't think of a single movie musical that was a giant hit in the past few seasons. And I suspect Back to the Future and Almost Famous to flop hard.

[pethian]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 8:01pm

Two other good examples of lesser known/non-mainstream films being the source material for excellent musicals are SMILES OF A SUMMER NIGHT and HAIRSPRAY.

[HenryTDobson]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 8:30pm

KJisgroovy said: "It gets under my skin when people complain about movie adaptations. Anything can be the source of a good musical. Anything. The problem is less the source and more the creative team. You have to fully adapt the material to the new format. I think some folks are correct in pointing out the more "well known" a property is... the more the creative team might feel beholden to giving the audience what they're expecting. Adding songs to a script that works much better without them without much else. There's a nuance that gets lost in the complaints about movie adaptations that I think mistakes what the actual problem is.

To be fair, many people in this thread have already articulated my points much better than I have. But. I thought it was interesting that someone in this thread complained about movie retreads while also naming a few movie adaptations as examples of successes."

Am I the someone you are referring? I complained about movie adaptations, but clearly stated that some work while others do not. I find that lesser known movies work better because there's less of an expectation  from audiences and the creatives have more freedom to use the material as they wish. Yes, it falls on the creative team. But no, I don't think all properties of all mediums should be musicalized. It's been discussed here at length, but the character Miranda is one that is challenging to musicalize and it appears the creative team has not done a good job. In another universe, could another creative team done a better job of musicalizing her? Possibly but we'll never know that, at least not in the near future. 

[Marlothom]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 9:23pm

Dua Lipa/Elton John's "Cold Heart" came on while I was at the gym, and it made me think of a "score" using his catalog as a backbone for new songs might have been an interesting take.  Hearing Beth Leavel belting something using the backbone of "The Bitch is Back" or "I'm Still Standing" - ah the possibilities.  

Updated On: 7/22/22 at 09:23 PM

[Up In One]

Posted: 7/21/22 at 11:29pm

MrsSallyAdams said: "I'm sad to hear that the libretto is missing the mark. The thing about The Devil Wears Prada is that it's not a story about Andy, her boyfriend, or even fashion. It's about when your job becomes an abusive relationship. I've never worked in fashion but I have worked in the arts. You're poor, desperate and full of ambition. The people with the power to pay you got there through some combo of privilege or ruthlessness.

Miranda Priestly is an abusive narcissist. Andy and her coworkers grow submissive and desperate to please. They're so transfixed by Miranda's ego that they can't imagine breaking free and continuing their careers elsewhere. Streep could be funny but she was also terrifying. The people writing this show may be too powerful to understand the helpless situation that the Andy's of the world get trapped in."

 

Did we ever get the full story of why Paul Rudnick left the show as book writer? We know Elton John literally phones in his work and is not an active collaborator. But with Rudnick there was hope for a smart and funny book. 

 

[Bill Snibson]

Posted: 7/22/22 at 12:46am

Marlothom said: "Dua Lipa/Elton John's "Cold Heart" came on while I was at the gym, and it made me think of a "score" using his catalog as a backbone for new songs might have been an interesting take. Hearing Beth Leavel belting something using the backbone of "The Bitch is Back" or "I'm Still Standing" - ah the possibilities."

This is exactly the “outside the box” brainstorming that needed to happen. This woulda been an insane mash-up that truly could’ve worked. Add in Elton John underscoring. Chef’s kiss! 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 7/22/22 at 3:28am

Up In One said: "Did we ever get the full story of why Paul Rudnick left the show as book writer? We know Elton John literally phones in his work and is not an active collaborator. But with Rudnick there was hope for a smart and funny book."

No, we didn't. He was initially announced as sole bookwriter; then Kate W joined and they were sharing credit; then Kate W eventually got sole credit. So we don't know how much of "his" book remains and if he requested that his name be removed from it.

Regardless, it sounds like they need a more experienced hand to drive this book –– and maybe a team that Elton had existing relationships with. I don't know if guys like Lee Hall and Stephen Daldry would have helped this show (certainly wouldn't have helped optics), but they at least know Elton and the way he works, as well as the needs of a commercial musical.

[bk]

Posted: 7/22/22 at 5:07am

JasonC3 said: "InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "Everything is all IP now."

I get your apparent frustration, but this is a sweeping generalization.

And Broadway musicals have been adaptations or based on books, movies, and plays for decades, including Sondheim.

"

The standard argument but which completely misses the point. It's all branding today and the difference between branding and the musicals of old, which you're trying to equate this to, is that the musicals of ofd went out of their way NOT to have the book title or the film title or the play title. You do get that, right? It's not The Apartment, The Musical, it's not Green Grow the Lilacs, The Musical, it's not Nights of Cabiria, The Musical, it's not Smiles of a Summer Night, The Musical, it's not Liliom, The Musical, it's not They Knew What they Wanted, The Musical, it's not The Rainmaker, The Musical, it's not The Fourposter, The Musical, it's not The Matchmaker, The Musical, it's not Lili, The Musical - well, one could go on for hours. While there are a few shows that kept the source material title, they aren't the norm pre-1980. 

[OhHiii]

Posted: 7/22/22 at 10:17am

bk said: "JasonC3 said: "InTheKnowEvenIfYouDontBelieve said: "Everything is all IP now."

I get your apparent frustration, but this is a sweeping generalization.

And Broadway musicals have been adaptations or based on books, movies, and plays for decades, including Sondheim.

"

The standard argument but which completely misses the point. It's all branding today and the difference between branding and the musicals of old, which you're trying to equate this to, is that the musicals of ofd went out of their way NOT to have the book title or the film title or the play title. You do get that, right? It's not The Apartment, The Musical, it's not Green Grow the Lilacs, The Musical, it's not Nights of Cabiria, The Musical, it's not Smiles of a Summer Night, The Musical, it's not Liliom, The Musical, it's not They Knew What they Wanted, The Musical, it's not The Rainmaker, The Musical, it's not The Fourposter, The Musical, it's not The Matchmaker, The Musical, it's not Lili, The Musical - well, one could go on for hours. While there are a few shows that kept the source material title, they aren't the norm pre-1980."

What is even your point? That you dislike IP musicals that keep the original title?? 

The truth of the matter is that without big name musicals on Broadway, the other, more risky ventures wouldn't be on the main stem either. Broadway is branded the way it is thanks to those big musical names and it's what draws tourists to see theater. Many folks' first Broadway show is a big IP show and creates fans of theater and Broadway as a whole, thus building the overall Broadway audience ecosystem. Yes, the quality of recent adaptations has been utter crap (Doubtfire, Pretty Woman, etc.), but there are original musicals that are utter crap that make it to Broadway too. Gettin' The Band Back Together anyone? 

If you don't like movie adaptations, then don't buy a ticket idk what to tell you.