Two different productions of the same show on Broadway?

[Theatrefanboy1]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 10:52am

Has New York ever had two different productions of the same show play at the same time?   I was talking about the two sunset Boulevards one in the west end. And one in Australia coming up.  And I’m curious if Webber would ever approve of the two of them to transfer and play at the same time or near to the same time.  I know back in the day he had three different versions of JCS on the go. But those were all spread out a bit more.  And I know some shows like the glass menagerie have played up against each other pretty close.  Curious if there ever had been

[berniesb!tch]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 10:59am

I am no expert on rights and licensing, but I think having two different productions of the same show would not be able to happen at the same time in the same area on a Broadway level. I don't think the rights holder would allow that to happen - but I could be incorrect

[QueenAlice]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:01am

As mentioned elsewhere,  the production of SUNSET BOULEVARD with Sarah Brightman is being produced by an Opera Company in Austrailia.  It is highly unlikely to have any kind of commercial transfer, because the way opera is produced is not compatible with commercial Broadway producing.

Its also highly unlikely that there would be two first class productions of a work under copyright presented at the same time in a major market city like New York.  That is what estates and rights holding is all about.

Of course, there have been scripts in public domain to play at the same time in major cities.  And it will be interesting to see what happens with THE GREAT GATSY which is a public domain property being adapted for Broadway by two different creative teams.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:02am

The only circumstance would be a classic, public domain work, or a work adapted from one (such as the competing GATSBYs or WILD PARTYs being in development simultaneously). And we've seen a race for those in recent seasons (Scott Rudin prematurely announcing Glenda Jackson's LEAR before a director was even in place, because the Ian McKellen LEAR was also trying to come in; two Broadway MACBETHs in one calendar year; Pacino and F. Murray Abraham doing Shylock simultaneously).

It would be foolish for a rightsholder/author to approve two different productions of the same show, and then there's the theater owner issue.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:06am

In 2015-16, some of us wondered “what if HAMILTON opened a second Broadway company?” But the reality is they probably would have hurt each other & the tours and ultimately wouldn’t have been a cost effective thing to do.

[JoeW4]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:07am

In 2016, the Japanese company Takarazuku brought their all-female production of Chicago to the Koch theatre at Lincoln center, as part of the White Light festival. Interestingly, the Takarazuka replicated the Walter Bobbie staging - so for that week or so, Walter Bobbie's staging of Chicago was actually playing at 2 different theatres in NYC at exactly the same time.

Updated On: 10/13/23 at 11:07 AM

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:13am

JoeW4 said: "In 2016, the Japanese company Takarazuku brought their all-female production of Chicago to the Koch theatre at Lincoln center, as part of the White Light festival. Interestingly, the Takarazuka replicated the Walter Bobbie staging - so for that week or so, Walter Bobbie's staging of Chicago was actually playing at 2 different theatres in NYC at exactly the same time."

Yes and the Weisslers + Kander would have had to sign off on that. And they were probably ok with it as long as there were advertising restrictions, and knowing that it was such a limited, novelty run and unique set of circumstances.

The approval is what prevents regional theatres (and sometimes colleges and community groups) within X proximity of NYC from doing certain shows if the commercial rights are tied up. I remember Paper Mill saying they tried to do WEST SIDE STORY for a decade but couldn't because of the rights.

[Broadway61004]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:57am

berniesb!tch said: "I am no expert on rights and licensing, but I think having two different productions of the same show would not be able to happen at the same time in the same area on a Broadway level. I don't think the rights holder would allow that to happen - but I could be incorrect"

The rights holders could allow for 2 different productions at the same time (they could license as many as they want wherever they wanted to). But it would be incredibly foolish of them to do so since they'd just be competing with one another.

The only way I could maybe see it work is if they were two radically different interpretations and they marketed it as "come see both shows to see different takes on it" (almost marketing it like they're in rep--"Come see the traditional production of West Side Story in the afternoon and then Ivo Von Hove's new interpretation in the evening". But I highly doubt that would actually be profitable.

[OhHiii]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 12:07pm

What has possessed people to think that this Sarah Brightman production on the other side of the planet is going to have any life in NYC? She's not a bankable star here and no one is clamoring for an opera production of the show to come to Broadway. The only reason people are even discussing a Sunset revival at all is because of this production. The last one was by all accounts a flop and that had Glenn Close.

[QueenAlice]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 12:09pm

Actually a rights holder usualy can not license two different productions at the same time - at least not in the same area..Once you grant the FIRST CLASS rights to someone, they have the 'right' to solely produce the play. That is what a rights agreement is about.  

As mentioned with the production of CHICAGO that came over from Japan -- permission would have been required from both the granters of the Broadway rights and the current rights holders (The Weisslers).

 

Updated On: 10/13/23 at 12:09 PM

[QueenAlice]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 12:15pm

OhHiii said: "What has possessed people to think that this Sarah Brightman production on the other side of the planet is going to have any life in NYC? She's not a bankable star here and no one is clamoring for an opera production of the show to come to Broadway. Theonlyreason people are even discussing a Sunset revival at all is because ofthisproduction. The last one was by all accounts a flop and that had Glenn Close."

I think there would be suitable interest by the ticket buying public in NYC to see Sarah Brightman play the part, but as mentioned, it would likely necessitate the production being picked up by the Metropolitan Opera (unlikely) which would be a limited number of performances. The economics of a production built for an opera house aren't compatible to those for a commercial production

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 12:22pm

OhHiii said: "What has possessed people to think that this Sarah Brightman production on the other side of the planet is going to have any life in NYC? She's not a bankable star here and no one is clamoring for an opera production of the show to come to Broadway. Theonlyreason people are even discussing a Sunset revival at all is because ofthisproduction. The last one was by all accounts a flop and that had Glenn Close."

Exactly. The shock factor of the Jamie Lloyd production (+ Scherzinger) is the only thing giving that revival juice to transfer here, and even that stripped-down revival would be a big risk without a bigger star. And I'm sure they already went out to bigger stars before NS.

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 1:47pm

The Weisslers did a similar thing in the 90s when the national tour of Grease played at City Center while the revival was still running at the Eugene O'Neill Theatre, but that wasn’t a different production of Grease, that was two identical productions with different casts. I can’t remember the story behind why they did that.

[pmensky]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 1:55pm

The only way these two productions could happen on Broadway simultaneously would be if ALW/RUG paid for and produced both productions, so there wouldn’t be a conflict of interest in terms of licensing. It would be absolutely bonkers, but absolutely amazing. 

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 2:42pm

Hasn’t this happened frequently with west end shows? I seem to recall the UK 25th anniversary tour of Les Miserables played the Barbican Theatres whilst the original production was still playing the Queens theatre. That’s not to mention the anniversary concerts for Les Mis and Phantom that were put on at Royal Albert Hall and the O2 arena while the west end production were still running.

[Fosse76]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 2:56pm

No. The show's producer(s) would have exclusivity of the work. So, unless it is *their* production (the 1994 production of Grease was joined on Broadway by its national tour for a week in 1996), only a public domain work adapted by different creatives and different producers would be able to run concurrently. 

EDIT

That second production of Grease was at City Center, so there may be something in the License agreement with the Broadway landlords that prohibit additional productions in Broadway houses (not explicitly, but by inference). Particularly if one of the productions is not sold out (Grease was sold out,  which is why they brought in the tour).

 

Updated On: 10/13/23 at 02:56 PM

[Sharpie3]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 3:14pm

Not New York but the anniversary tour of Les Mis played the Barbican at the same time the original production with the turntable was at the (then) Queen's Theatre in 2010.

[ChairinMain]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 6:21pm

There's occasionally been two of the same Shakespeare play  playing in NYC but never competitively on Broadway. 

I'd be curious if the Met produced La Boheme during the Baz Luhrmann's run on Broadway in 2002/2003...they tend to do it every season. The Met's database, which would be the best source for this, has been offline for weeks. 

[Fan123]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 6:34pm

As an old-school example, when HMS PINAFORE was first produced in America, Gilbert and Sullivan didn't have copyright protection for the show in the US, so there were loads of unauthorised US productions around 1878-79. This apparently included a time during which "In New York, different productions of the piece played simultaneously in eight theatres within five blocks of each other", according to Wikipedia.

[B212323]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 7:33pm

ChairinMain said: "There's occasionally been two of the same Shakespeare play playing in NYC but never competitively on Broadway.

I'd be curious if the Met produced La Boheme during the Baz Luhrmann's run on Broadway in 2002/2003...they tend to do it every season. The Met's database, which would be the best source for this, has been offline for weeks."

I know New York City Opera did in the spring of 2003 while Baz's Boheme was still running on Broadway 

[topcateast]

Posted: 10/13/23 at 11:52pm

ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "In 2015-16, some of us wondered “what if HAMILTON opened a second Broadway company?” But the reality is they probably would have hurt each other & the tours and ultimately wouldn’t have been a cost effective thing to do."

Not long after The Lion King opened there were rumors on the street that because of the high demand for tickets, Disney was considering opening a second (identical) production in another Broadway house. It never happened, obviously, but it was an interesting idea.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 10/14/23 at 12:06am

topcateast said: "ErmengardeStopSniveling said: "In 2015-16, some of us wondered “what if HAMILTON opened a second Broadway company?” But the reality is they probably would have hurt each other & the tours and ultimately wouldn’t have been a cost effective thing to do."

Not long after The Lion King opened there were rumors on the street that because of the high demand for tickets, Disney was considering opening a second (identical) production in another Broadway house. It never happened, obviously, but it was an interesting idea."

This is pie in the sky stuff, but the real way to do it would be two casts in the same theatre & set, RADIO CITY style. And duplicate stage management/wardrobes/wigs/crew, service providers & agencies being paid above normal rates, etc.

Very few shows in the history of Broadway could sustain that kind of demand, and it still doesn't help you on the hottest nights of the week (Fri/Sat). Special Theatrical Events have done it. Radio City has loads of empty seats most performances outside of peak times, and 11am is a little more appropriate for a holiday show than GUTENBERG. But I'm sure Disney or Seller or someone has tried to game out the budget & feasibility just to see.

Supply & demand is a good thing.

Updated On: 10/14/23 at 12:06 AM

[BroadwayNYC2]

Posted: 10/14/23 at 12:11am

Book of Mormon also considered two productions (and transferring theaters), but obviously didn’t happen. 

[Theatrefanboy1]

Posted: 10/14/23 at 1:06pm

Interesting.  Thanks for this insight.  I know up here (though smaller market). We’ve had RENT tour and regional  have performed. I was curious if it happened.  Great conversation. I had no idea about some of these considerations with lion king and Book of Mormon 

[jkcohen626]

Posted: 10/14/23 at 1:34pm

BroadwayNYC2 said: "Book of Mormon also considered two productions (and transferring theaters), but obviously didn’t happen."

Very curious to know what would have happened to Mormon if it had moved to a bigger theatre.