Report Abuse Links opinion thread — Page 12

I have frequently criticized individual posters on the board for excessive nastiness toward individual performers or being prematurely critical of early previews--

--AND I have (perhaps) been guilty myself of (perhaps) excessive criticism of certain productions and performances (Arthur Laurents's WSS)--

BUT I find this clamor to "TAKE DOWN THE BOARDS!" among theater artists I respect to be disturbingly fascistic.

There. I have said it. Rob has done a masterful job of responding to the outcry and instituting reforms. But, hey, Broadway performers, "Take down the boards!" does NOT have the heroic ring of Ronald Reagan's "Tear down this wall." It is stifling dissent, and it is as ugly as the ad hominem attacks you are protesting, perhaps uglier..

Thanks, Rob, as always, for the gift that this website has been and continues to be.

Updated On: 3/12/16 at 09:10 AM

Most of those in support, I believe, love BWW in general. They don't like the chat boards. They are giving Patti virtual high fives and ink in support of the overall message - which is more about proper moderation than about removing the boards. It's just there's a lot of noise about both. I don't believe Rob would ever truly consider removing the message boards from this site. And that doesn't need to happen. What does need to happen is that people should post with respect. Some here seem to think that means they can't say what they want or that it means it has to be rainbows and puppy dogs. That's very black and white. It's also wrong. It means that words matters. And that some people have not chosen their words with much thought - but in an effort to one up another in hyperbole. It serves no purpose. There are many ways posters can dissect a show, performance, etc. Some here certainly are all bent out of shape when it's turned on them, aren't they?

I think there are two things that bother me here about "Patti's Rant".

1. She has largely ignored all the positive comments, discussions and even reprimands (from amongst posters) that do happen. Specifically, the thread about her show closing was OVERWHELMINGLY supportive of the cast & crew. Just like an elementary teacher punishing the whole class because 4 kids misbehaved for a substitute, this is blaming the whole for the behavior of some.

2. As a number of posters have pointed out, her own blog and twitter is full of the same type of comments she's calling people out for on this site. I believe the adage, "Physician heal thyself," is apropos here.

dramamama611 said: Just like an elementary teacher punishing the whole class because 4 kids misbehaved for a substitute, this is blaming the whole for the behavior of some."

Well there's another way to look at it. And that is that everyone here should be helping to police the board so that those 4 or 5 people don't diminish all the good that does come from the board. But usually that doesn't happen - in fact, people start bandwagoning instead. So there is a level of culpability when forum members don't report threads or posts. Is it the forum members job to do so, no. But it doesn't say much when the community at large sits by and does nothing about it either. Because it does reflect on the whole community. For better or worse.

Or maybe this board should be properly moderated, which it hasn't been for years. Physician heal thyself, indeed.

Updated On: 3/12/16 at 09:56 AM

Did someone report the list thread? I was going to add Mr Nic Rouleau.

Call_me_jorge said: "Did someone report the list thread? I was going to add Mr Nic Rouleau.

"

I'd also like a list thread. It's fine if these actors want to stand by and support the nonsense Murin has said but I'll gladly save my hard earned money instead of giving it to these bunch of whiners next time they have a Broadway show open.

Updated On: 3/12/16 at 10:14 AM

A blacklist has no place on these forums. I suggest you keep your own list if you feel so strongly about who you want to support or not. Your threat of not supporting shows with some of these performers reminds me of some of the tech forums where people are against one company and thinks they are scum but willingly buy other products that have that other company's parts. You can do what you want with your money. But if you want to suggest what they are doing is whining and what posters here are doing is something different - then you aren't being objective. They might be in a profession that opens them up to criticism. But the moment you post on a forum - you open yourself up to criticism as well.

I'm not seeing objective criticism from Patti et al. I'm seeing a demand for control over how people talk about them, which is totally different.

AC126748 said: "Or maybe this board should be properly moderated, which it hasn't been for years. Physician heal thyself, indeed.

"

Agree with this. I think some of the bandwagoning occurs because people get frustrated with certain posters who are allowed to troll for so long. There are so many screen names I can think of who were straight up trolls who stayed around for too long. They interrupted every single thread just to have their voice heard and did not contribute well to the topics. I have been to other forums where I posted seriously and maybe didn't think twice before posting a couple of things that weren't even trolling, just not in good nature, and got warned by the mods rather quickly. I mean within 15-20 minutes.

Craig said: "A blacklist has no place on these forums. I suggest you keep your own list if you feel so strongly about who you want to support or not. Your threat of not supporting shows with some of these performers reminds me of some of the tech forums where people are against one company and thinks they are scum but willingly buy other products that have that other company's parts. You can do what you want with your money. But if you want to suggest what they are doing is whining and what posters here are doing is something different - then you aren't being objective. They might be in a profession that opens them up to criticism. But the moment you post on a forum - you open yourself up to criticism as well.

"

I respectfully disagree, if someone wrote a list of people who are a certain political party or sexual orientation or race, etc then that's wrong. However, when someone criticizes your hangout without telling the whole story and others respond with calling names or treating her like she's Norma Rae definitely deserves to be noted. If you care then don't go to their shows, if you don't, proceed. Why was it ok for her to name posters and tell them to "introduce" themselves but we aren't allowed to name the supporters? I do care about censorship in this way because it's again telling us that actors have more respect than us to BWW.

Kad said: "If performers were actually being harassed or the subject of libelous talk, I would understand the outrage.

But this is, at worst, snark and gossip. The people who bear the worst of the talk are the members themselves. "

This.

I didn't see the list at all; was it on the off-topic board? User-generated suggested blacklists should be fine because (1) they're nonthreatening, (2) they serve to centrally inform those who specifically seek it, when the information is otherwise spread across too many sources, and (3) people have a right to spend their money on whom they wish, or not. It's no different than best-of threads, worst-of threads. All of these things are easily ignored if you're not interested.

Speaking of which, I wonder if the "unpopular opinions" thread(s) will be deleted wholesale or half the posts removed; I don't read those threads because they're going to be specifically negative, but they shouldn't be heavily censored or removed either, otherwise what's the point of a community board when you can't vent opinion on both sides.

I didn't like the list. I read it and it wasn't accurate. Some names were there that were later pointed out shouldn't be there at all...but like a headline that shows up on page one and then a retraction that posted at the bottom of page ten, the name is forever out there. I didn't feel it was right and it didn't feel like censorship at all to remove it. It felt to me like the right thing to do.

I don't need or want a list..I am entirely intelligent and able to learn for myself who I want to see in the theater and who I don't. If someone reads an article or comments by someone like Patti, please feel free to leave a link so I can read what was said..and make up my own mind.

Updated On: 3/12/16 at 10:49 AM