Riedel on Head Over Heels being on thin ice- Page 3

[20806]

Posted: 7/27/18 at 11:48pm

SomethingPeculiar said: "The show really does need an "ambassador" to talk about it in the press, which would be an ideal role for Paltrow. An unflappable champion of the show like Oprah with Color Purple, Rosie with Taboo, or Sting with The Last Ship. Her commitment to something she believes in would look stronger than her hiding from it. (She literally talked about Goop in the NYTimes 3 days ago)

But if the lead producers can't figure out how to market it, and if they don't have a deep-pocketed investor to throw money into a burning hole, the future looks grim."

How does that work? The investors put in say $10m. The show loses $100,000 say per week. I guess there is a reserve. Once thats exhausted who is paying the $100,000 of outgoings each week? The investors are limited partners. The corporation is thinly capitalised. Does the lead producer put their hand in their pocket every week to keep it open (eg OOTI most weeks)?

[RippedMan]

Posted: 7/27/18 at 11:58pm

A lot of factors involved. They could waive the theater's rent, etc. 

I mean, I think they'd be silly to not at least try and have the Go-Gos be the band for the show at least? It's not a bad show at all. I had a great time, but I do agree, I don't know how you'd market this? Maybe up the "comedy" aspect? I don't know.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 12:15am

@20806 Typically, it would be done through priority loans after as many expenses as possible have been deferred, renegotiated etc. (There is a limit to which this can be done to the extent of union contracts of course.) Honestly, I don't think there is anything to salvage here. I don't think there would have been much of a bump even had the Times review been in line with the (not insubstantial) more positive ones. I don't think we will see the OOTI style nonsense going on with this one. And I likewise don't think much improvement would be noticed were the Go-Gos to get involved (doing what? certainly not Kitt's orchestrations...) If it didn't work with Sting or Billie Joe Armstrong, much bigger names, why would it work here? Sad but how it is; this one is a head scratcher.

[20806]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 1:04am

HogansHero said: "@20806 Typically, it would be done through priority loans after as many expenses as possible have been deferred, renegotiated etc. (There is a limit to which this can be done to the extent of union contracts of course.) Honestly, I don't think there is anything to salvage here. I don't think there would have been much of a bump even had the Times review been in line with the (not insubstantial) more positive ones. I don't think we will see the OOTI style nonsense going on with this one. And I likewise don't think much improvement would be noticed were the Go-Gos to get involved (doing what? certainly not Kitt's orchestrations...) If it didn't work with Sting or Billie Joe Armstrong, much bigger names, why would it work here? Sad but how it is; this one is a head scratcher.”

I assume once they get to the point of priority loans the chance of the original investors getting anything back is about zero, short of Bette Midler agreeing to do a nightly cameo?

 

[SomethingPeculiar]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 1:38am

20806 said: "I assume once they get to the point of priority loans the chance of the original investors getting anything back is about zero, short of Bette Midler agreeing to do a nightly cameo?"
 

Priority loans get paid back before the original investors, so yes, the chances of rebounding and turning a profit are slim (but not unheard of). 

Legend has it, one of the only big hits that turned around after taking a priority loan was the original Smokey Joe's Cafe, which went on to run for 5 years. And I remember reading that Comet was partially capitalized via a priority loan, which impacted their profitability during Groban's initial run, and Bright Star took one out after its surprise Tony nomination.

[A Director]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 4:05am

Why not close HOH and transfer DON'T BOTHER ME, I CAN'T COPE to the Hudson?!?!

[haterobics]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 9:01am

RippedMan said: "they'd be silly to not at least try and have the Go-Gos be the band for the show at least?"

Isn't the band only revealed for the first and only time at the curtain call?!

[taylortrensch]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 11:24am

haterobics said: "RippedMan said: "they'd be silly to not at least try and have the Go-Gos be the band for the show at least?"

Isn't the band only revealed for the first and only time at the curtain call?!"

correct! ^

[VotePeron]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 12:30pm

Remember during Bright Star when Steve Martin would play in the Act 2 opener? Could they restage the title number at the start of act 2 to incorporate the actual Go-Gos playing?

[SomethingPeculiar]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 12:51pm

The Go-Go's presence is not going to make any difference for this show. I just don't think the general public cares that this show features songs by the Go-Go's, unfortunately.

[UncleCharlie]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:27pm

SomethingPeculiar said: "The Go-Go's presence is not going to make any difference for this show. I just don't think the general public cares that this show features songs by the Go-Go's, unfortunately."

I agree with this... but even if it would, they are not listed as producers. It's not clear they have any sort of financial or creative involvement in the show other than their songs being used which I imagine they get some sort of licensing fee for. They're scattered all over the country. Are they really going to drop everything they are doing to rush to New York to play a few songs a night, 8 times a week to try to save a show that seems doomed regardless?

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 2:43pm

to beat a dead horse...

if you take the number of people who would be inclined to see the show because of the physical presence of all or some of the Go-Gos (not that large I would think), and subtract the number of people who would be inclined to see the show because of the Go-Gos' songs without them (an even smaller number), the idea that bringing them in (even were there an incentive or desire for them) would sell enough tickets to make a difference is pretty uninviting.

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 7/28/18 at 9:56pm

msmp said: "ScottyDoesn'tKnow2 said: "msmp said: "haterobics said: "little_sally said: "How long before a B list celebrity mysteriously comes in an replaces a cast member for 3 weeks?"

Would have to be a Go-Go, no?"

Would anyone but Belinda Carlisle be a big enough name to fill the theatre (and even then it's a stretch)? There are a lot of Go Go's fans, but I'm not sure there are enough to keep the show afloat. Carlisle might be able to get a couple sell-out shows though."

Only if the show has "Heaven is a Place on Earth"."

I thought HoH did include "Heaven is a Place on Earth" but point very much taken!"

Oh it does!

[sewhite2]

Posted: 7/29/18 at 12:22am

Fordham2015 said: "broadwaynerdnewbie said:Does anyone know what press agency is in charge of marketing for this show? I’m just curious"

Boneau/Bryan-Brown

"

They probably don’t know how to market this because they didn’t hire me As their intern !! Lol jk I still wouldn’t know how to market this. I feel like it could have done so much better off broadway? Idk

[Bettyboy72]

Posted: 7/29/18 at 4:13pm

Bringing in a stunt cast will increase costs and defeat the very purpose. Bringing Belinda (she's the only viable one) or Ms. GOOP onboard would inflate the budget. Gwyneth sells beauty and lifestyle-to promote the show would sully her branding and prostitute her empire. Not gonna happen. I think shes on to the next thing already, honestly. This show sounds DOA. 

[RippedMan]

Posted: 7/29/18 at 10:39pm

I think they marketed this fine. I mean the art work and posters are evocative of what the show is...it's just no one cares...? 

[nasty_khakis]

Posted: 7/29/18 at 10:53pm

Logistically, though, is Belinda that big a draw? Keep in mind they'd need to pay her a "star" salary AND Rachel York hers (Jackie Hoffman was paid for every week of Whoopi's run in Xanadu). I can't imagine they'd make $2m  a week based on people wanting to hear her sing a line of a song here and there. 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/29/18 at 11:58pm

art work and posters do not marketing make. 

the "proof" that the marketing is not fine is that my non-theatre friends, almost all of whom are in the target market, are completely unaware of the show when I mention it. 

[RippedMan]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 12:06am

I don't think that's true. I walk by the posters in the subway all the time, I see them on cabs, I see them on bus stops, I see them in Times Square. I mean, I guess there is something to say, but maybe people just aren't looking? I tend to be someone who looks at all the ads on the subway and I'm actually a very observant person. 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 12:33am

Yeah, we all have things that resonate for us more than other things. And in particular I notice theatre posters in the subway etc but I blast right past most of the movie posters without even noticing that they are there. I think we can probably agree there is not enough of a market for this show to begin with (it's one of those organic failures, aka DOA shows) but I also don't think they cracked the full potential of people who know the words to most of the songs. 

[bear88]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 1:42am

Both things are probably true.

Head Over Heels is inherently a tough sell. The Go-Go's had a short run as a band, with a few hits along with Belinda Carlisle's solo hits, but they're not a big name group with lots of familiar songs - outside of a relatively narrow age range. The quirky plot and faux-Elizabethan language wasn't going to help attract those very people. I had to talk my wife into attending the show in its San Francisco tryout (she's indifferent about the band), and I knew I was taking a chance. And then we both thoroughly enjoyed it, despite its flaws. We ended up seeing it twice.

Coming to Broadway, they had no stars to sell. The show was going to have to be marketed shrewdly and word of mouth was going to have to be fantastic. It doesn't seem like enough people were aware there was a musical based on Go-Go's songs. The obvious pitch - a fun, exuberantly silly sex farce - wasn't really tried unless I missed something.

The show was drawn a mixed reaction on this board, both in San Francisco and New York, The reviews were also mixed. But given the show's very low numbers, I can't imagine how a bunch of rave reviews would help. There simply isn't a large enough audience for the show. This was an off-Broadway musical that was dumped into a Broadway house after a short out-of-town tryout and no opportunity to make adjustments. I'm surprised the musical is doing so badly, as I am fond of it, but I'm not surprised it's failing at the box office.

[LightsOut90]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 4:57am

the amount of retweeting going on by everyone involved is not a good sign, im calling labor day on this one folks. 

[newintown]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 7:35am

Kad wrote: "Whitty isn't exactly a blameless individual."

Expound?

[ScottyDoesn'tKnow2]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 4:57pm

Every time I think of Broadway posters in subways and cabs and stuff without being effective, I think of In Transit. There was a time where I felt like all I saw were ads for that show and me, being a theater person inclined to see a show, still had no interest in seeing the show or even knew what the show was about until I decided to look it up on a whim after seeing somebody post about it on BWW. When I'm at Penn Station, I think about that giant Bronx Tale poster by the 6th ave. entrance and how blah the artwork was for that.

[ACL2006]

Posted: 7/30/18 at 5:41pm

On "The View" today, Whoopi gave the show huge praise and told everyone to go see it NOW and not to go by the reviews. Not sure how much Whoopi's approval will help, but it's something.