Cameron Mackintosh transphobic comments

[FANtomFollies]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 4:53pm

Daily Mail article

Les Miserables and Mary Poppins producer Sir Cameron Mackintosh slams idea of giving transgender people roles in classic shows as 'gimmick casting'

• Cameron Mackintosh said shows shouldn't be rewritten for transgender actors
• Producer of Les Miserables and Mary Poppins argued it would damage storylines
• Said casting transwomen as leads is 'trying to force something that isn't natural'
• Added it would be 'gimmick casting' because it 'isn't inherently there in the story'

[EDSOSLO858]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 4:56pm

Yeesh.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 4:58pm

And Michael Ball as Javert and Nick Jonas as Marius weren't gimmick casting?

Jonathan Pryce playing the Asian character of the Engineer in MISS SAIGON sure as hell wasn't "natural."

Give me a break and shut your mouth, Cameron! Be silently transphobic like the majority of the rest of the commercial theatre world!

[TotallyEffed]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:18pm

What is up with the UK being so transphobic?

[JBroadway]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:28pm

Infuriating, but not at all surprising coming from him. 

[BrodyFosse123]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:33pm

Jonathan Pryce playing the Asian character of the Engineer in MISS SAIGON sure as hell wasn't "natural."
 

The Engineer is Eurasian not Asian.  He is mixed race.  The controversy surrounding Pryce was the prosthetics used on his eyes in the original London production.  Those weren’t used for the Broadway production.  

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:38pm

FANtomFollies said: "Daily Mail article

Les Miserables and Mary Poppins producer Sir Cameron Mackintosh slams idea of giving transgender people roles in classic shows as 'gimmick casting'

• CameronMackintosh said shows shouldn't be rewritten for transgender actors
• Producer of Les Miserables and Mary Poppins argued it would damage storylines
• Said casting transwomen as leads is 'trying to force something that isn't natural'
• Added it would be 'gimmick casting' because it 'isn't inherently there in the story'

"

The one quote here I consider transphobic is "trying to force something that isn't natural." That's awful.

I'd agree that shows shouldn't be re-written. I would also agree casting a transperson, depending on the show, could damage the storyline (as casting a white person as Porgy or Bess would damage the storyline of that work, or casting a 23 year old as the older version of one of the principles in Follies would damage the storyline of that work, etc.). Also would agree, if it was done as a gimmick, it would be a dreadful mistake (and, honestly, an abuse of the transperson as thing to be exploited rather than as a human being with inherent value). 

But "'force something that isn't natural"??? Seriously? Ugh, unfortunately, yes, he was serious. I hope any trans person, as any cis person, who auditions for a role has the same hope of being cast as anyone else who auditions. 

[pmensky]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:39pm

It’s strange how a gay man who has spent his entire life working in the arts can have these kinds of opinions. The guy spent his mid-teens to his mid-20’s growing up in the 1960’s, and he’s most famous for producing a musical about the little people fighting to the death to challenge the system. You’d have thought that his life and his art would have taught him better.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:41pm

When we talk, as we do in other contemporaneous threads, about systemic racism, which is of course a subset of all systemic prejudices such as the one we are discussing here, and people act like it doesn't exist, this right here is what we are talking about: a bunch of (mostly) old white men with tons of power making decisions that negatively affect anyone that doesn't look and act like them. The Old Boys Club Incarnate. The only difference here is that CamMac is oblivious to how noxious his statement is. If you watch old game shows to fall asleep sometimes as I do, you'll see the full panoply of similar prejudices on full display that it would be unimaginable to hear out loud and in the cultured public today. 

[Ravenclaw]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:47pm

BrodyFosse123 said: "Jonathan Pryce playing the Asian character of the Engineer in MISS SAIGON sure as hellwasn't "natural."


The Engineer is Eurasian not Asian. He is mixed race. The controversy surrounding Pryce was the prosthetics used on his eyes in the original London production. Those weren’t used for the Broadway production."

The prosthetics were certainly part of the controversy, but it definitely didn't end there.

Updated On: 8/27/21 at 05:47 PM

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:57pm

BrodyFosse123 said: "The Engineer is Eurasian not Asian. He is mixed race. The controversy surrounding Pryce was the prosthetics used on his eyes in the original London production. Those weren’t used for the Broadway production."

Don't split hairs.

It doesn't matter if the character is 100% Asian or mixed-raced, the point is a white actor should not have been playing a character with Asian heritage, and that is where the controversy stemmed from on Broadway with Equity.

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 5:57pm

pmensky said: "It’s strangehow a gay manwho has spent his entire life working in the arts can have these kinds of opinions. Theguy spent his mid-teens to his mid-20’s growing up in the 1960’s, and he’smost famous for producing a musical about the little people fighting to the death to challengethe system. You’d have thought that his life and his art would have taught him better."

It's sadly easy for me to comprehend. People are often far more narrow-minded than you'd assume, and even those who were disenfranchised are often fine with disenfranchising others. 

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:00pm

It always amuses me that people are outraged when people who are heading towards 80 years old aren’t as open minded as they are.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:09pm

And all this just a week after Michael Riedel called a drag queen a "transvestite" in the NYPost.

[JBroadway]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:11pm

joevitus said: "I would also agree casting a transperson, depending on the show, could damage the storyline (as casting a white person as Porgy or Bess would damage the storyline of that work, or casting a 23 year old as the older version of one of the principles in Follies would damage the storyline of that work, etc.)." 

 

Depending on the show? Maybe. If a show were to feature plot points that specifically center around the anatomy of a character's body, then I can see a situation where this is true. But even that's debatable and conditional - not all trans women have the same anatomy as each other, plus some trans people may "pass" as cis onstage or onscreen. For example, the recent movie "Together Together" featured a trans actress playing a woman who becomes pregnant, and it totally read as realistic to me. And that's on film, where it's much harder to suspend disbelief. 

Offhand, I can't think of a single Cameron Mackintosh show that wouldn't be able to cast trans actors - either because it doesn't matter to the story (e.g - why couldn't Mary Poppins be trans?) or because the shows already call for suspension of disbelief (POC have been cast in Les Mis for decades, and nobody cares about the historical inaccuracies).

BTW - a disclaimer about what I just wrote:

I know that discussions around "passing" can be particularly sensitive in the trans community, because it runs a constant risk of coming across as a positive/negative dichotomy - i.e "passing = good" "non-passing = bad" which is of course, a very toxic way of thinking about trans people's gender presentation. So I just want to clarify that when I defend trans casting by citing that some trans actors can pass as cis, I only mean that in regards to the hyper-specific cases where a character's anatomy is important to the story, and the piece doesn't allow for suspension of disbelief. 

 

Updated On: 8/27/21 at 06:11 PM

[SmoothLover]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:12pm

How unfortunate.

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:12pm

Jordan Catalano said: "It always amuses me that people are outraged when people who are heading towards 80 years old aren’t as open minded as they are."

You're easily amused. This isn't like he holds a private opinion. He's a potential employer for hundreds of thousands of performers, and he's publicly stating this. This isn't your older uncle or grandpa at Thanksgiving you can just ignore when inappropriate things are said.

How bizarre that you attack people on the other forum for saying "More racial equality is necessary, but this approach to it won't work" yet you're chuckling that a major employer is telling people he won't hire them because they are trans.

Updated On: 8/27/21 at 06:12 PM

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:25pm

What other forum? Where have i attacked anyone? What the hell are you talking about?

Updated On: 8/27/21 at 06:25 PM

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:58pm

I wonder what Disney thinks of his comments…

[CATSNYrevival]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 6:58pm

It’s kind of amusing how Cameron Mackintosh of all people has the gall to denigrate the "ruining" of a classic show with transgender casting. The only one ruining long running classic musicals right now is him.

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 7:13pm

Joevitus, still waiting for you to explain what the hell you’re talking about.

[¿Macavity?]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 7:39pm

It just reads as cruel and out of touch. Why is CamMac trying so hard to wreck his legacy?? He's taken one heck of a dive the last few years and been painful to watch.

[Alexander Lamar]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 7:45pm

There’s a difference between casting a trans actor and making a character trans as a plot point but he’s a ****ing idiot and probably doesn’t realize that.

Also just in response to someone else, I’m not at all shocked that a gay man is transphobic. Many cis people are, regardless of orientation.

[JSquared2]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 8:09pm

FANtomFollies said: "Daily Mail article

Les Miserables and Mary Poppins producer Sir Cameron Mackintosh slams idea of giving transgender people roles in classic shows as 'gimmick casting'

• CameronMackintosh said shows shouldn't be rewritten for transgender actors
• Producer of Les Miserables and Mary Poppins argued it would damage storylines
• Said casting transwomen as leads is 'trying to force something that isn't natural'
• Added it would be 'gimmick casting' because it 'isn't inherently there in the story'

"

Bravo!  Good for him.  

[joevitus]

Posted: 8/27/21 at 8:46pm

Jordan Catalano said: "Joevitus, still waiting for you to explain what the hell you’re talking about."

Wasn't at my laptop. Unless I'm wrong, and I'll totally own it if I am, you've called people bigots in the New Deal for Broadway thread for rejecting a policy in which people will be castigated for choosing white people for their creative teams, when there's no way to know if said persons chosen were chosen for their skin color or their talent. But here you're okay with the biggest producer in Western theater explicitly saying he will not cast trans people in roles because they are trans.