2024-2025 Tony Awards thread (Eligibility Rulings, etc)

[KevinKlawitter]

Posted: 11/14/24 at 6:05pm

First round of rulings is out

Nothing too earthshaking, but here are some highlights:

• Cole Escola will contend in Leading Actor in a Play for Oh, Mary
• Laura Donnelly will contend in Leading Actress in a Play for The Hills of California 
• Yellow Face has been ruled a Revival 

[Alex Kulak2]

Posted: 11/14/24 at 11:11pm

Offering a hundred bucks to whoever can successfully explain non-binary people to the Tony Eligibility Committee.

[DrMonicaDeMoneco]

Posted: 11/14/24 at 11:25pm

Alex Kulak2 said: "Offering a hundred bucks to whoever can successfully explain non-binary people to the Tony Eligibility Committee."

Oh good grief. Enough with this woke stuff. 

[HenryTDobson]

Posted: 11/14/24 at 11:29pm

Is Michael Urie above the title for OUAM?

[CoffeeBreak]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 12:00am

Like other big cities, it's time for Best Lead/Supporting Performer in a play/musical.  Men & women in same category.   Then pick the top two performances of the year.  

Updated On: 11/15/24 at 12:00 AM

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 12:10am

HenryTDobson said: "Is Michael Urie above the title for OUAM?"

No.

[Kad]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 12:15am

Alex Kulak2 said: "Offering a hundred bucks to whoever can successfully explain non-binary people to the Tony Eligibility Committee."

Has it not been established that non-binary performers can choose which category they wish to be considered for? Short of eliminating gendered categories entirely, which is not the eligibility committee's purview, I'm not sure what else the committee can do here.

Updated On: 11/15/24 at 12:15 AM

[Robbie2]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 1:08am

DrMonicaDeMoneco said: "Alex Kulak2 said: "Offering a hundred bucks to whoever can successfully explain non-binary people to the Tony Eligibility Committee."

Oh good grief. Enough with this woke stuff."

lol you sound like my mom

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 3:36am

DrMonicaDeMoneco said: "Alex Kulak2 said: "Offering a hundred bucks to whoever can successfully explain non-binary people to the Tony Eligibility Committee."

Oh good grief. Enough with this woke stuff."

I hope you never fall asleep

[Mr. Wormwood]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 3:51am

I feel like letting nonbinary actors choose their category has worked fine so far. I hate the idea of two winners per category. Hate it.

[CoffeeBreak]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 8:22am

It's the same thing just genderless. 

[kdogg36]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 11:25am

Mr. Wormwood said: "I hate the idea of two winners per category. Hate it."

Well, there are two winners now who are doing the exact same job; it just so happens that things are arranged to produce a male winner and a female winner (or a nonbinary person competing in one of those categories). We still don't know who the real winner would be if the two competed head-to-head. Separating actors by gender (but not writers, directors, etc.) is an ingrained tradition, so we don't tend to think critically about it, but it's a pretty artificial way to generate two winners when only one can really be the best.

 

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 11:28am

Also, what is the negative impact of having a single gender less category? Especially, where there are two winners? There is none. 

[Voter]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 11:33am

I'm all for non gendered acting categories at awards shows. What part of being a good actor is about gender? Does being male make you predisposed to be a better actor? No. It's the same thing, and it makes no sense to gender art. We don't have best direction of a musical by a woman. Because artistic talent isn't influenced by gender (except inspirations and life experience). And yes, I also love that it would make awards more inclusive to non-binary and gender non-conforming individuals. To reference a few commenters ago, no I don't see equality as "woke". It's just sense.

[Broadway61004]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 3:23pm

This is all fine and good until the year 8 men and 2 women are nominated for Best Lead or all 4 acting categories go to the same gender. It's nice to sit here and think "that shouldn't matter" but you all know the pitchforks would be out in either scenario.

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 4:46pm

Broadway61004 said: "This is all fine and good until the year 8 men and 2 women are nominated for Best Lead or all 4 acting categories go to the same gender. It's nice to sit here and think "that shouldn't matter" but you all know the pitchforks would be out in either scenario."

No reputable awards body that has gone genderless has seen swings of that magnitude in any given year, as far as I know.

The benefit is also that sometimes there ARE more great performances by women, or vice versa, and it can reduce some of the "fifth slot" nominations for weaker performances.

Looking at a single year is meaningless for that type of thing; it's all about the trend over a 5-10 year period. And I'd venture to guess that, at the end of the day, more women than men would be nominated at the Tonys and Oscars.

Separating performance in a revival vs performance in an original work could also be a way to retain 8 acting categories, since they're such different "assignments." (One could argue that the Directing categories would benefit from that split too, though that's kind of a different convo)

[CoffeeBreak]

Posted: 11/15/24 at 6:27pm

We agree.  The directing categories have long deserved a split.  They are very different.  Revivals vs completely new show with that director from the beginning.

Shows like Maybe Happy Ending would probably be in the revival category however.  The show is the same from all of the Asian runs.  It's just a new production of an existing show.  So it would fall into the revival category as the current directing/creative team saw video/photos and expanded on the previous versions with $ for Broadway.   The director does not have to work with writer developing the script and show itself, which a normal new work director would.  A simpler and less time consuming task.  Same for plays like The Thanksgiving Play which was stronger under different direction at Playwrights Horizon than Broadway.

Shows like Swept Away, Tammy Faye, Redwood, Death Becomes Her, Boop, Smash etc would be in the "Director of a new musical" category with only 1 director attached to the show's current and previous production(s).

Updated On: 11/16/24 at 06:27 PM

[Jeffrey Karasarides]

Posted: 11/16/24 at 4:44pm

I've seen someone championing genderless acting categories at the Tonys countless times. He's even suggested that instead of having two winners per acting category, they could create new categories for ensemble casts. That would not only allow more actors to be recognized, it would also honor ensemble shows.

My argument there is if that was in place in 2019, Best Featured Performance in a Musical would’ve only gone to either André De Shields or Ali Stroker. Had De Shields won, it would’ve been at the expense of Stroker’s history making win. Had Stroker won, it would’ve been at the expense of the Broadway legend’s very first Tony. Even if one of them received an ensemble award, it still wouldn’t have been as special as winning an individual prize.

[Voter]

Posted: 11/17/24 at 3:19am

But even in their own categories, sometimes someone equally deserving of the award loses. Ruthie Ann Miles gave an amazing performance in The King and I, but both Sydney Lucas and Judy Kuhn in Fun Home were equally deserving. Sadly, only one person can win. Unless they choose to award 2 winners in the categories, which some awards shows have done. 

[Owen22]

Posted: 11/17/24 at 8:34am

Broadway61004 said: "This is all fine and good until the year 8 men and 2 women are nominated for Best Lead or all 4 acting categories go to the same gender. It's nice to sit here and think "that shouldn't matter" but you all know the pitchforks would be out in either scenario."

It isn't just the nominees.  What happens when two men actually WIN??

I'm guessing these acting award categories were originally delineated because in our patriarchal society, men would probably usually win because misogyny. This, at the time, seemed fairer.

But, as we just saw in the elections, maybe we haven't come so far (I think when gender-less awards are given they still tend to favor men). I would vote for keeping things the way they are at least until we achieve some kind of sex equality....whenever that may be....

[Voter]

Posted: 11/17/24 at 11:47am

Statistics from awards shows that have moved to gender neutral acting categories have not shown favor towards men.

In the 2 awards shows they've held since the Independent Spirit Awards went gender neutral in 2022, 14 of the 20 nominees for best lead performance have been women.

Since going gender neutral in 2022, the Drama Desk Awards have nominated 9 women, 12 men, and 1 non-binary person in their lead performance in a musical category. 12 women, 7 men, and 1 non-binary person for their supporting performance in a musical award. 11 women and 12 men for their lead performance in a play award. And 11 women  and 11 men in their best supporting performance in a play award.

Since going gender neutral in 2021, the Gotham Independent Film Awards have nominated 25 women and 15 men for lead performances.

We saw that women lacked opportunities in other fields, and therefore had less opportunity for nominations. For example, in 2018 women made up only 18% of the directors on Broadway, and only 13% in 2019. But last season 16 of the 38 shows that opened on Broadway were directed by women. And we saw that make a shift at the Tony's, where 4 of the 5 nominees for best direction of a musical were women, and 3 of the 5 nominees for best direction of a play were women. 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 11/17/24 at 12:03pm

I don't know what the gender parity is like for the nominating committees of those other awards bodies, but it's nearly even for the Tonys (28 women/32 men last year, 29 women/32 men this year) –– and that's only accounting for gender diversity, not field of work, race, sexuality, etc.

Updated On: 11/17/24 at 12:03 PM