Is It Time For Performers To Renegotiate The 8 Show Week?- Page 2

[JBroadway]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 12:11am

With 10-out-of-12s, I can understand why people feel like: even though it's always been done this way, all it takes is one look at the practices with fresh eyes to see how unfair it is. But with the regular show schedule, I don't know, it feels like more of a grey area. I've only done 8 shows a week on a few occasions, for some very short runs. So I can't speak to the experience of doing this over the course of months.

So I'm actually wondering: IS this something that theatre workers find to be an undue strain? Because we can try to parse out the math all we want, with their breaks per hour, hours per week, weeks per year, and how that compares to their pay. It's worth scrutinizing that data, but at the end of day, the only way to really know how much of a burden it is, is to do it. 

Maybe I'm just out of the loop from the Twitter-sphere, but are people actually raising widespread complaints with the performance schedule? Or is this just a spin-off conversation from a Theatremania article about the pros and cons of alternates? I looked at the NM10/12 website and I'm still unclear on whether their "6 day work week" refers only to tech rehearsals, or to regular runs in general. 

In any case, the more we run through this, the more I'm reminded of how fragile and seemingly unsustainable the entire commercial theatre model is for the world we live in, on so many levels. 

[BCfitasafiddle]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 12:24am

I think in order for Broadway to be profitable, 8 shows a week will always be necessary.

That being said, I think it will become more normalized for actors to share roles and there to be alternates for roles. There are some role now that do it, but I could see it becoming a more regular occurrence. Especially in musicals. It's a hard gig. Thinking especially of parents of young children. 

[joevitus]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 12:47am

I generally agree that if announcements were made in advance, not many people would complain, but that doesn't say how many people would just not go because, say, they are in town to catch some shows, they can only make X show for a matinee, and Big Star doesn't do the 8 shows a week thing anymore. If a lot of people stop getting tickets for certain performances because the prominent players aren't going on those days, that could really hurt a show's ability to survive. 

[binau]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 4:07am

I will always feel sentimental about the tradition of an 8 show week - there was something nice about Bernadette, for example, stepping into Hello Dolly after the extended preview period with Bette Midler in the role (:p) and doing 8 shows - truly back where she belonged. However, in terms of health of the performers it does seem like the 8 show week is a bit much for certain roles. Bernadette shouldn’t have had to struggle so much physically and vocally in some of her runs and I think about extreme cases (eg Alice Ripley) and wonder whether the 8 show week destroyed her voice.

That said, I just hope that if it becomes the norm to have an alternate they do a bit better than the West End about being transparent who performs when - and good policies re: refund or exchange if you don’t see who is advertised. While maybe getting better I feel the West End is notoriously behind Broadway in terms of consumer rights. I would hate to see it erode.

Updated On: 10/16/21 at 04:07 AM

[JayElle]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 4:47am

nasty_khakis said: "I have no problem with alternates as long as it's clearly advertised dates. You can't use actors in your ads "see the Tony-nominated performance!" but then put someone else on without warning (injuries and sick days happening day-of not withstanding)....taking a 50/50 shot when buying a ticket isn't worth the risk.(That's an example, I'm not sure if they have or will announce dates).

Totally agree. I bought Funny Girl tkts & now must exchange if it's true an alternate will perform matinees. I want to see Beanie, not an alternative.  

Had same problem with Tina. Didn't think alternates equalled Adrienne Warren's performance. All I ask is notice of alternate.  Has Hades announced her alternate?

 

Updated On: 10/16/21 at 04:47 AM

[UncleCharlie]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 4:53am

Tag said: "UncleCharlie said: "And I have to say at the risk of being unkind, almost all theater actors are just coming off a 19 month period of zero on stage work. To raise this issue of we're being worked too hard now, just feels a bit tone deaf to me."

The reason this is gaining traction now, is exactly because of this. Theater workers (btw it isn't just actors...) had this time off and got to see what having alife was likeaway from working 6 days a week. "

Have they not ever gotten to see what having a life was like before the pandemic all the times they were between shows for months at a time when they weren't working at all? That's my point. How many of the people involved with this prior to the pandemic were working 52 weeks a year, year after year after year? I'm guessing very few.

 

[adotburr]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:08am

JayElle said: "nasty_khakis said: "I have no problem with alternates as long as it's clearly advertised dates. You can't use actors in your ads "see the Tony-nominated performance!" but then put someone else on without warning (injuries and sick days happening day-of not withstanding)....taking a 50/50 shot when buying a ticket isn't worth the risk.(That's an example, I'm not sure if they have or will announce dates).

Totally agree. I bought Funny Girl tkts & now must exchange if it's true an alternate will perform matinees. I want to see Beanie, not an alternative.

Had same problem with Tina. Didn't think alternates equalled Adrienne Warren's performance. All I ask is notice of alternate. Has Hades announced her alternate?

"

Hadestown has announced the alternate and she’s already gone on as Persephone but has not released her schedule. At least that I can find anywhere. Considering Amber is out more than what the alternate will do anyway, the likelihood of seeing Amber is low. Just go in expecting to not see Amber and be surprised if she is on. So far this week she only did the Wednesday shows:

Lana (alternate) Tuesday

Afra (understudy) Thursday

Lana (alternate) Friday

Afra (understudy) Sunday)

[A Director]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:20am

The Distinctive Baritone said: 

Yes, some Broadway actors have lots of extra rehearsals etc. between shows. And if they have an issue with a 40 - 45 hour work week doing for a living wage what most people are willing to do for free, then maybe they should get another job.

WTF?   Why pay actors in the first place?  Why not hire people who will work for free? You are a teacher. There are many people who think teaching is a cushy job. The believe teacher work for nine month and then get a three month vacation!

Seriously it’s been a year and a half now of theatre people complaining online about how much they hate the theatre industry and although I get it, I’m so over hearing about it."

Many theatre people complain about the working conditions in the theatre and want to improve and make things better.  How sad you don't understand this!

 

[Impeach2017]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 7:37am

Show business is hard, and the hours are lousy.  You are always working when most people are off and want to have fun.  That's the way it is and always has been.  Want set hours and weekends free?  Get a nice government job.  

[unclevictor]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 11:16am

How to make an actor complain? Give em a job.

[iluvtheatertrash]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 11:47am

My God, some of you truly are insufferable.

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 12:05pm

Love you too.

[binau]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 1:20pm

I guess the other thing of course is Broadway shows are too expensive as it is and the market is not exactly hot right now. Even if it’s the ‘right’ thing to do by actors the more we demand things that push up costs the greater likelihood we are making shows less financially sustainable than they already are. Don’t actors already find it difficult enough to find and keep jobs on Broadway?

[Kad]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 1:27pm

I think a bit of an issue here is that performers are co-opting issues being raised by other theater workers, who have their own set of challenges.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 1:39pm

Great point, Kad. 

[fosterfan2]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 4:58pm

adotburr said: "JayElle said: "nasty_khakis said: "I have no problem with alternates as long as it's clearly advertised dates. You can't use actors in your ads "see the Tony-nominated performance!" but then put someone else on without warning (injuries and sick days happening day-of not withstanding)....taking a 50/50 shot when buying a ticket isn't worth the risk.(That's an example, I'm not sure if they have or will announce dates).

Totally agree. I bought Funny Girl tkts & now must exchange if it's true an alternate will perform matinees. I want to see Beanie, not an alternative.

Had same problem with Tina. Didn't think alternates equalled Adrienne Warren's performance. All I ask is notice of alternate. Has Hades announced her alternate?

"

Hadestown has announced the alternate and she’s already gone on as Persephone but has not released her schedule. At least that I can find anywhere. Considering Amber is out more than what the alternate will do anyway, the likelihood of seeing Amber is low. Just go in expecting to not see Amber and be surprised if she is on. So far this week she only did the Wednesday shows:

Lana (alternate) Tuesday

Afra (understudy) Thursday

Lana (alternate) Friday

Afra (understudy) Sunday)"

Why is Amber Gray out so much?

[iluvtheatertrash]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:15pm

She just had a child and is easing back into it.

[Sutton Ross]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:23pm

She had her last child in 2018 so I wouldn't say "just". 

[adotburr]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:38pm

Amber was out again today. Someone in the understudies thread posted they stopped by the theatre and checked the understudy board and Lana was on. So I’m guessing she is on vacation or a scheduled week off.

But precovid she was out a lot. Filming aside, it seemed like one of her understudies would go on at least once or twice a week at one point. 

Updated On: 10/16/21 at 05:38 PM

[Kip4]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 5:52pm

unclevictor said: "How to make an actor complain? Give em a job."

I hate to say it, but I think unclevictor has a point.  Of course an 8 show week is grueling.  But what's more grueling is being an actor who also works a full-time job and balances rehearsals and shows on top of that.  Try working an 8 hour shift and then going straight to the theatre to do a leading role.  At least in this case, the show IS their job.  There are so many more difficult things than being in a show.  Ask doctors and nurses if they want to renegotiate their work schedules, and their jobs are essential!  

[HogansHero]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 6:53pm

Kip4 said: "There are so many more difficult things than being in a show. Ask doctors and nurses if they want to renegotiate their work schedules, and their jobs are essential!"

First, how is that relevant? Second, two wrongs don't make a right. Third, doctors and nurses DO have negotiated work schedules. Yes of course during the initial Covid crisis, crisis conditions applied but in general both doctors and nurses working in hospitals have very specific hours. So what seems to be persuading you falls flat under analysis. 
 

This is not to say that performers' work schedules ought to change but let's try to avoid lame reasons for keeping them the same.  Anything is open to negotiation, but as I have said previously, there is a quid pro quo for every negotiated change. Realism rather than fantasy helps. And the road to hell is paved by following trolls into their ditches.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 6:54pm

Agreed, Kip. It's a grind and most of us are just happy to be working. 

My biggest peeve is having the work when everyone else is enjoying their holidays. My family is all engineers, so they never understand when I work weekends/holidays. But I enjoy performing, so for me it's not so much "work." 

Maybe they should just do a split? Like each lead also does ensemble. So, take Wicked. We have 2 Elphabas, 2 Galindas. They each get 4 performances in the lead, and 4 performances in the ensemble. I know it's not really a "break," but ensemble will give them a break from having to wear their vocals out. 

[Bill Snibson]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 9:29pm

One day off a week feels kinda barbaric…

[Kip4]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 9:30pm

Hogan, nothing is “persuading me.” I simply meant that a 2 show day is not the same as a 12 hour shift in a hospital.  When put into perspective, there are much harder jobs. 

RippedMan - good point about the holidays. Alternating seems like a smart idea! I do think there are intelligent solutions to some of these issues. But as you said, it’s a grind!

Updated On: 10/16/21 at 09:30 PM

[HogansHero]

Posted: 10/16/21 at 9:43pm

@Kip I think you might be surprised but that's not the point, which is that creating equations is not a meaningful way to assess things or negotiate. If that were the case, we'd make it about coal miners.