Mike Pence Gets "Boo'd" at HAMILTON Tonight- Page 16

[cmassoud]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:12am

Yes this is the problem

The trump supporters in this thread think that a man who is supporting the genocide in Syria, supports dictators, who wants to bring back torture, and to use it on terrorist's family members, as well as deport everybody of a certain religion and put them in a database

is just saying nasty words

[aaaaaa15]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:14am

Equality should be earned? Erm nope, equality should be a birth given right.

[uncageg]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:20am

MyFavoriteBrunette said: "Mr. Nowack said: "What a mess on all fronts. This kind of situation DOES NOTHING to bring together two extremely opposing groups. It only pushes them farther away. Everyone should be ashamed and footing the blame.

My husband feels this way.  He said today to forget a world war, we're going to have our very own second American Civil War.
 


 I have been tossing this around in my head and agree with the above 2 comments. My friends and I have been talking about a Civil War since the middle of the campaign.

my question is , has this cast directly addressed a political figure in the past after a performance?  A lot have attended including the President. I remember that Javier went on when Obama saw the show but I don't remember hearing that the cast addressed him t curtain call.

Here is my feeling, it is fine to have your thoughts and political opinions. It is a right. The statement Mr. Dixon made was beautifully written and I feel they should have done it as a press release. Pence was probably not the only Trump supporter in that theater that night. So those people, hopefully, enjoyed a show and then had this happen at curtain call. It kind of overshadows the evening. For some though, it may not have.

On the flip side, this has not been your ordinary campaign or election. People are upset and frustrated. Me included. It may not make a difference but he and Trump need to hear directly from voters how they feel and this was done. People have marched for various issues but this seems to have been a wake up call and maybe a Civil War is in the cards. I just hope   we get through this and come out ok. This isn't about political parties, it is about basic values and fear that all of the progress that has been made in this country could be ripped apart.  Just my random thoughts.

 

 


"

 

 

[ErikJ972]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:23am

Colorblind Ideology Is a Form of Racism

A colorblind approach allows us to deny uncomfortable cultural differences.

 

 

"Racism? Strong words, yes, but let's look the issue straight in its partially unseeing eye. In a colorblind society, White people, who are unlikely to experience disadvantages due to race, can effectively ignore racism in American life, justify the current social order, and feel more comfortable with their relatively privileged standing in society (Fryberg, 2010). Most minorities, however, who regularly encounter difficulties due to race, experience colorblind ideologies quite differently. Colorblindness creates a society that denies their negative racial experiences, rejects their cultural heritage, and invalidates their unique perspectives."

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/culturally-speaking/201112/colorblind-ideology-is-form-racism

[dramamama611]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:31am

I'm going to make a guess here.  I'm going to guess that he WAS invited backstage, as has every "important" person been.  He (for whatever reason) declined.  They felt they had no choice.

 

He is not a Trump supporter, he is the vice president elect of the country.   Not quite the same thing.

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:37am

The idea that it would have been acceptable only if the message was given backstage to Mike privately is just silly. It was meant to be seen and shared. It was meant to tell people that they are not alone and that you can stand up to this administration and have a voice. 

[haterobics]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 10:48am

mar6411 said: "Dave 28282 is the former Dave19.  So he has a long history.  Always remember him from his Dave19 days - not as a new poster."

Ahh, that makes a lot of sense now.

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 11:00am

For all of you bitching (hyperbolically about Pence’s views

There is nothing hyperbolic in fearing the appointment of a man who supports conversion therapy for gays.  And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

If you surround yourself with your mean-girl friends, march over to someone you have an issue with and say "I'd like to...um...like talk about how you suck and stuff...but with LOVE, ya know...", that's not really dialog.  That’s being a bully.

And that's not what they did.

Singling someone out in a hostile crowd and lecturing them from the stage is an aggressive and mean act. It's ONLY a "I'm gonna dump my poo on you and you can't say nothing" act. It was juvenile, graceless and pointless.  I know, I know...your f-ing issues are sooo important that any need for common dignity or courtesy goes right out the window.  You're at WAR!!  Well, explain that to the Syrians...

Now, that's a PERFECT example of being hyperbolic.

What the Hamilton cast, the audience, and most of the posters here have explained to me very clearly is that I’m not welcome in the theater.

You're Mike Pence?  Huh.  What you have determined is "very clear" may be true from the couple of people in the audience and a couple of posters here, but that assumption based on the short speech delivered by one member of the Hamilton cast is nonsensical.

That’s fine, my support and business goes elsewhere.

Okay.  I don't think anyone will have a problem with that.

I can't stand Pence, I think he's a real low-life, but if he payed for admission they shouldn't harass him.

Well, he wasn't harassed by the cast.

It was just so wrong and inappropriate for a statement to be made at any type of performance to an audience member for no reason.

There was a reason.  It was stated.  In the statement.

It was the same as if he would have attended a comedy club show and been heckled for no reason by the comic on stage.

Perhaps if at was after the comic's show just before people are leaving the room and the comic addressed him without actually heckling him, but making a rather soft statement that included thanking him for attending.  Then it might be an apt comparison.

The people using words like "harass" and "bully" in reference to the statement made by one member of the cast clearly have never been harassed or bullied and/or couldn't be bothered to see what actually occurred and hopped on the Fox News spaghetti-throwing gotcha-media Palin Party Bus.  If you think the cast harassed and bullied Pence, you live a very charmed and privileged, albeit ignorant life.

[Theater_Nerd]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 11:31am

Reading through this thread is so disheartening. 

It's actually very sad and troubling but a pretty accurate snapshot of what this country is: divided.

We are in for some very dark times ahead indeed.

[fbueller]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:01pm

Scarywarhol said: "The idea that it would have been acceptable only if the message was given backstage to Mike privately is just silly. It was meant to be seen and shared. It was meant to tell people that they are not alone and that you can stand up to this administration and have a voice."

I agree that the cast message was fully intended to be seen and shared.  The intent from the very beginning was for the cast speech to go viral.

Brandon was on the CBS News show this morning stating that the goal was to initiate a conversation with Pence.  How is a one-sided political speech a conversation?

Brandon simply wanted more Twitter followers and the show wanted even more publicity.  

[Jordan Catalano]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:02pm

Oh, shut up. Fool. 

[Pippin]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:12pm

Here's a silver lining for today:

While all of this is going on around us: Hate, pain, Disappointment, Sore Losers, Sore Winners, and fear that I see on the faces of many people I pass on the street in NYC, for the first time, in a Long time, Maybe since the Original production of HAIR, a musical is at the front and center of a national debate. Musicals Like Mormon, Producers, Phantom, et. al are cultural icons, but not titles that start actual political debates among Americans about who we are as a country. Because of the actions of what the cast did on Friday night, people all across the country are debating the place of performing arts in America, and we are being reminded of how integral it is to the American way, to the many freedoms that we experience as Americans: freedom of expression, freedom of opinion, freedom of choice, freedom of religious practice, and freedom of speech. It is no coincidence that Hamilton, as well as HAIR started at the Public, who's truncated mission statement follows: "The Public serves as an advocate for the theater as an essential cultural force in leading and framing dialogue on important issues of our day.  These core democratic values, set in place by its visionary founder, Joseph Papp, inform all aspects of The Public’s activities."

 

I think Joe Papp would be extremely proud that theatre is at the forefront of not only the NYC dialogue, but also a national dialogue. This is when theatre is vital. This is when theatre creates change, and new ideas. This is when theatre artists step up and say We care about the World, and we are going to make a difference. 

[After Eight]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:19pm

"How is a one-sided political speech a conversation?"

 

It isn't. Did the cast wait on stage to allow Pence to respond, and then "converse" with him? Moreover, even if they had, their ambush was prepared in advance; Pence would have had to answer extemporaneously. Not exactly an even playing-field for that purported "conversation."

The whole episode was a disgrace, as are the efforts to cover up what it actually was.

Updated On: 11/21/16 at 12:19 PM

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:23pm

Goering Booed At Theater, Hitler Demands Apology

[Mister Matt]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:25pm

Brandon was on the CBS News show this morning stating that the goal was to initiate a conversation with Pence.  How is a one-sided political speech a conversation?

I can help you learn about conversations!  A conversation requires the involvement of two or more parties.  In this case, Brandon represents the 1st party and Pence represents the 2nd party.  The goal of the 1st party was to initiate the conversation with a (brief) statement addressing the 2nd party.  The 2nd party responded to the statement .  Statement from the 1st party + response from the 2nd party = conversation.  Goal achieved.  Had the 2nd party not responded, then it would have been one-sided and the 1st party would have failed in reaching their goal.  

Maybe it would be easier to understand if we had those talking silhouettes from The Electric Company.

[bloomerific]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:26pm

Jordan Catalano said: "Oh, shut up. Fool."

*standing ovation*

Yes, Brandon was SOOOOO looking for more Twitter followers, fbueller. Totally seems like that kind of person. *eyeroll*

Pardon me if I repeat a lot of what people have said, but this thread has gotten WAY large! :) 

Honestly--some of the responses that I've gotten on Twitter and Facebook have been absolutely ridiculous. Just when I thought, "I'm gonna be the bigger person here" and not delete people for being horrible--I quickly resigned to the fact that there are just really twisted people in this world. It is scary, it is upsetting, and the willingness to jump on something without even READING is unbelievable. I'm 40, have been going to NYC to see shows since 1996 (and in the past 2 years I have been going 4-5 times a year) and before that spent most of my time seeing touring shows and shows in Toronto. One of my "friends" actually said to me, "have you ever been to a Broadway show?" Really? I about died. 

Of course not all theater people/actors/etc. are liberal...but let's face it--artists and lovers of artists tend to be on the leftist side. And you know what? I'm proud of that. People can call me a crybaby, a jerk, a bleeding-heart, over-sensitive--and you can go ahead and do that. I've been called everything under the sun, completely marginalized for my gender & weight, and horrible things have been said to me for YEARS. And having someone entering the White House who says things like this really does trigger really bad emotions for me. 

I will say again--go ahead. Boycott something that is sold out forever. Boycott something that 90% of theatergoers will stand behind. Boycott something that is artistic, a speech that was yes pre-planned but was respectful, and a group of performers that give more than any "boycotter" would ever be able to do. Plus, am I about to go to a Ted Nugent concert? No. Am I about to stand in line to meet Scott Baio? No. We all CHOOSE to do things, to spend our money on things, do what we WANT. It's not like those who were booing Mr. Pence were chucking bottles/drawing swastikas/holding nooses like I have seen over and over again in the past two weeks. 

You don't like it? Don't go. Don't listen. Erase the cast recording from your phone. Break the CDs. If you have tickets, stand in front of the Richard Rodgers and give them away to people who have been dying to see this art form. Leave it all to those of us who appreciate art in many different forms, and the freedom to express such art however we choose. And most importantly? Take yourself out of these boards. I'm all about dissenting viewpoints, that's the point of most things, but don't be hateful and generalizing when you don't know a darn thing about the situation.  

I really have been trying to be positive...but this feels like the arts in general are just going to go back to being an afterthought--as it has been in previous administrations. I'm not looking forward to those type of cuts especially at the school-age level, but across the board. I'm trying to stay positive about it, but feels like the first example. 

 

[After Eight]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:32pm

"Take yourself out of these boards. I'm all about dissenting viewpoints"

 

You are? You actually don't see the disconnect between those two statements?

 

 

[ebontoyan]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:37pm

^Need to include everything in the quote, A8, not just what supports your train of thought. I got what you said bloomerific and thank you for the post! Also don't mind A8, he hates Hamilton and everyone on this board has known that for months!

Updated On: 11/21/16 at 12:37 PM

[Petralicious]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:43pm

bloomerific said: "J

I will say again--go ahead. Boycott something that is sold out forever. Boycott something that 90% of theatergoers will stand behind. Boycott something that is artistic, a speech that was yes pre-planned but was respectful, and a group of performers that give more than any "boycotter" would ever be able to do. Plus, am I about to go to a Ted Nugent concert? No. Am I about to stand in line to meet Scott Baio? No. We all CHOOSE to do things, to spend our money on things, do what we WANT. It's not like those who were booing Mr. Pence were chucking bottles/drawing swastikas/holding nooses like I have seen over and over again in the past two weeks. 

You don't like it? Don't go. Don't listen. Erase the cast recording from your phone. Break the CDs. If you have tickets, stand in front of the Richard Rodgers and give them away to people who have been dying to see this art form. Leave it all to those of us who appreciate art in many different forms, and the freedom to express such art however we choose. And most importantly? Take yourself out of these boards. I'm all about dissenting viewpoints, that's the point of most things, but don't be hateful and generalizing when you don't know a darn thing about the situation.  

I really have been trying to be positive...but this feels like the arts in general are just going to go back to being an afterthought--as it has been in previous administrations. I'm not looking forward to those type of cuts especially at the school-age level, but across the board. I'm trying to stay positive about it, but feels like the first example. 

 

 

"How it was explained to me is that, people are going to start boycotting donating money to the arts, during those money drives, calls, letters check writing. Lets face it, the money is mostly not where the artists are but the bankers

 

[sarahb22]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 12:58pm

Here's my thoughts on the whole thing:

Pence was OK with what happened, so I'm OK with what happened.  Trump should have stayed out of it.  

That's it.

[Back Row]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 1:39pm

I've said this before on this thread, and I'll keep saying it: There are much bigger issues at play than whether the behavior of the Hamilton cast is appropriate or not. First of all, we have the President elect behaving like a child, still seizing every opportunity to sow division whenever he can, despite his phony claims that he wants to "unite us". And secondly, and more importantly, with demands like "apologize!" and "equal time!", he is inciting his army of cyber Brown Shirts to ensure that anyone who raises even the slightest voice of dissent will pay a heavy price for such insolence. And Trump knows exactly what he is doing. He's trying to make it extremely uncomfortable (and even dangerous) for ANYONE to speak up against him, it it is not hyperbole to call these Brown Shirt tactics. 

[gypsy101]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 1:40pm

After Eight said: ""Did the cast wait on stage to allow Pence to respond, and then "converse" with him? Moreover, even if they had, their ambush was prepared in advance; Pence would have had to answer extemporaneously. Not exactly an even playing-field for that purported "conversation."

The whole episode was a disgrace, as are the efforts to cover up what it actually was."

 

first of all, he'd already left the room. it's not like you can talk to someone if you aren't sharing space with them.

second, why is it not surprising that you support fascist dictatorships?

[gypsy101]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 1:42pm

Dave28282 said: "I'm going to Hamilton tonight..."

wouldn't it be easier to attend Hamilton if you 1) had tickets and 2) weren't in eastern Europe at the moment?

 

[Scarywarhol]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 1:44pm

After Eight defending the side of an administration that wants to spin the world backwards to a culture that never actually existed in the first place is the least surprising development. 

[BrightLights3]

Posted: 11/21/16 at 1:46pm

indytallguy said: "I wish Pence had gone backstage and the cast could have shared this message with him there and he could have respond so a real dialogue would have taken place.

Or Pence had told about the statement in advance and given an opportunity to come to the stage and respond or a facilitated talkback (don't @ me about how this would never happen ... I can dream).

I live in Indiana. I can't stand Mike Pence. And I believe as many others have noted that what was said needed to be said and that the statement was very respectful.

But, I also believe that people have a right to respond when criticism is lobbed at them, particularly in such a public way.

We desperately need more dialogue and less monologue in our politics."

 

I am using this post to reply more conceptually to the general outlook expressed in similar posts.

Traditionally, the theater is one of the few public spaces that has brought people of all classes and strata under one roof, and which, through art, enabled people to make their political opinions known directly to the powerful. In a way, the theater turns the powerful  into a "captive audience" for the public's grievances or, as the case may be, approval. 

Variations of the argument (here and particularly on social media) alleging the theater is / should be just an apolitical space to "relax", or guaranteed "safe space" insulating people in power from public opinion and letting them be just regular Joes and Janes, is a misguided disneyfication in my view. I don't mean to say every time a VIP comes into the theater they should be booed or cheered, but that there can always be such an expectation.

The history of theater has had people cheering pointedly at topical lines and refusing to let the play move on until the actors have repeated a pointed line over and over. Politicians throughout Western history have measured their success by whether they're cheered or booed there! What happened at Hamilton isn't some unprecedented act, alien to the nature of theater as a public space. This isn't new. It's one of the oldest, most traditional forms of voicing public opinion and protest there is.

The thought that there should be "equivalence" in public speaking in the theater as if this is an equal-rules election coverage, or a political debate space like congress, national assembly, parliament, etc., is, I think, misinformed. Theater is where art can speak truth to power - by what's performed on stage, and by the public response --and that includes the actors as well. Art is not in the theater to listen to power or "dialogue backstage" with it.

The actors aren't stage robots who leave their public - social, political, moral, citizen - persona at home. That they can be part of speaking truth to power isn't a novelty or a trendy SJW agenda. Julius Caesar had actors criticize him directly from the stage. Neither the public nor the actors are able to bring the VP elect backstage to "dialogue" if he plain doesn't want to or there are safety concerns. Their recourse is to make their opinions known while they have power in the seat as "captive audience". 

 

Updated On: 11/21/16 at 01:46 PM