Scott Rudin takedown - Page 18

[jo]

Posted: 4/21/21 at 8:44pm

HogansHero said: "Re important voices: It is inconceivable to me that anyone thinks that any "voice" is more important that Rudin's. How could it be?It is the sine qua non of the entire narrative. (It is also a voice that no one was expecting to hear. Recall that folks were saying he would never admit anything, never step away, etc. Did everyone's pivot blank out that memory?) If Rudin had not made his statement (without regard to whether he meant any of it), where would we be right now? My guess is we would have a bunch of unemployed actors. The other important voices are the ones we never heard. And never would. They are the voices that told Rudin that that gig was up. Let me ask: if not Rudin, what important voice would you nominate? (I understand of course about the voices of the victims, but those voices antedated this entire narrative. Cause and effect. We are on effect now."

That was an excellent way to put it! 

If people right now are not so sensitive about this debacle, this whole unravelling of the Rudin myth would be excellent material for a gripping and intense dramatic story. Play or movie. Who are going to play the roles?

 

 

Updated On: 4/21/21 at 08:44 PM

Posted: 4/21/21 at 8:49pm

HogansHero said: "Let me ask: if not Rudin, what important voice would you nominate?"

I will tell you right now that if you asked this question on Twitter, the 16-year-olds would all answer, in unison, "the accusers' voices are the most important".

Then they'd call you an enabler, post a screenshot of your LinkedIn and email your boss. I don't know why but that's how it would go. I don't make the rules.

Posted: 4/21/21 at 9:06pm

jo said: "If people right now are not so sensitive about this debacle, this whole unravelling of the Rudin myth would be excellent material for a gripping and intensedramatic story. Play or movie.Who aregoing to play the roles?"

This makes me wonder if a film could properly dramatize Rudin's abuse. I feel like abusive bosses, in the way Rudin is described, usually don't come off as monsters in movies. Ari Gold in Entourage was definitely abusive towards Lloyd, but he was one of the heroes of the show. Even something like Full Meta Jacket, where R. Lee Ermey's drill sergeant was such an abusive hard-a*s that he drove the lead to suicide - that whole portion of the film is beloved and people have canonized Ermey's character.

Take this anecdote, for example:

“I went into the kitchen, and I was like, ‘Hey, Scott, A24 is on the way up. I’m not sure what it’s concerning,'” the former assistant told THR. “And he flipped out, like, ‘Nobody told me A24 was on my schedule.’ He threw [the baked potato] at me, and I dodged a big potato. He was like, ‘Well, find out, and get me a new potato.'”

If that was dramatized, I honestly think there is no way it could realistically be played except for laughs. If you don't feel the acute fear of getting yelled at, the idea of seeing someone dodge a baked potato is objectively funny.

This tangent also makes me think Anna Wintour, model for Miranda Priestly from The Devil Wears Prada, might be on the shortlist to be cancelled.

Updated On: 4/21/21 at 09:06 PM

[fashionguru_23]

Posted: 4/21/21 at 9:22pm

jo said: "If people right now are not so sensitive about this debacle, this whole unravelling of the Rudin myth would be excellent material for a gripping and intensedramatic story. Play or movie.Who aregoing to play the roles?"

Tell me Ryan Murphy isn't salivating over something like this

 

[jo]

Posted: 4/21/21 at 10:08pm

ctorres23 said: "jo said: "If people right now are not so sensitive about this debacle, this whole unravelling of the Rudin myth would be excellent material for a gripping and intensedramatic story. Play or movie.Who aregoing to play the roles?"

This makes me wonder if a film could properly dramatize Rudin's abuse. I feel like abusive bosses, in the way Rudin is described, usually don't come off as monsters in movies. Ari Gold in Entourage was definitely abusive towards Lloyd, but he was one of the heroes of the show. Even something like Full Meta Jacket, where R. Lee Ermey's drill sergeant was such an abusive hard-a*s that he drove the lead to suicide - that whole portion of the film is beloved and people have canonized Ermey's character.

Take this anecdote, for example:

“I went into the kitchen, and I was like, ‘Hey, Scott, A24 is on the way up. I’m not sure what it’s concerning,'” the former assistant told THR. “And he flipped out, like, ‘Nobody told me A24 was on my schedule.’ He threw [the baked potato] at me, and I dodged a big potato. He was like, ‘Well, find out, and get me a new potato.'”

If that was dramatized, I honestly think there is no way it could realistically be played except for laughs. If you don't feel the acute fear of getting yelled at, the idea of seeing someone dodge a baked potato is objectively funny.

This tangent also makes me think Anna Wintour, model for Miranda Priestly from The Devil Wears Prada, might be on the shortlist to be cancelled."

Everytime I read about incident of "the brown-skinned potato" I always laugh at the thought.  Especially when he asks him to get him a new potato Dark comedy indeed. I also wondered whether some incidents were actually comical (such as someone ducking when the stapler flew towards him...or when someone who was the subject of Rudin's wrath would quit and leave...goes to Starbucks to cool off and returns to the office ... to find that Rudin has also cooled off and is asking him not to leave)... yep, more like dark comedy than straightforward drama!

I thought dramatizing the whole 15 days of tension after the THR report broke out ...the outcries ... the speculations...the discussions within...the unexpected Rudin departure... until Hugh Jackman ended the speculation about what happens to The Music Man...

Hhmm... maybe it would not be as appealing as "The Saga Of The Brown-skinned Potato" after all 

Updated On: 4/21/21 at 10:08 PM

[everythingtaboo]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 12:50am

What a laughably vague, pointless response from Hugh. I'm glad the show is going on, because I don't want those people to lose their jobs,  but Sutton's response was miles better.

[jo]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 1:33am

Hugh's message was loud and clear ... and the only important thing for those interested in The Music Man !

"The show will go on!"

 

[DiscoCrows]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 12:49pm

The Public has released a statement of their own:

https://twitter.com/PublicTheaterNY/status/1385273371873644548?s=20

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 12:51pm

Dang

[bjh2114]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 2:05pm

DiscoCrows said: "The Publichas released a statement of their own:

https://twitter.com/PublicTheaterNY/status/1385273371873644548?s=20"

Now THAT is how you compose a statement.

[VintageSnarker]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 3:33pm

"Yes, we’ve made our own mistakes and regret any moments where harmful behaviors were met with silence or excused, or where we could have held ourselves to a higher standard rather than simply acting in compliance with the law or our policies. But we’re committed to repairing and reconciling harms and creating environments where abusive behaviors are not tolerated, are called out immediately and without retribution for anyone speaking out, and are responded to with accountability and consequences."

This part though

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 10:12pm

Vulture spoke to 33 former assistants and interns:

https://www.vulture.com/2021/04/scott-rudin-as-told-by-his-assistants.html?

[missthemountains]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 10:17pm

I am pretty cynical, and I believe that Scott won't face any legal repercussions, but I have to say--it does seem like this is really the beginning of the end for him. Maybe I'm naive and he will just silently bankroll things from afar for the foreseeable future, but even if he gets all the anger management therapy in the world, there will be no doubt be countless individuals and organizations who will want nothing to do with being associated w/his name.

[unclevictor]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 10:49pm

https://www.vulture.com/2021/04/scott-rudin-as-told-by-his-assistants.html?

That Vulture article is a fantastic (and sad) read! Scott Rudin should never be allowed to work in theatre and film again.

 

Updated On: 4/22/21 at 10:49 PM

[SouthernCakes]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 11:04pm

Yeah it’s sad! He did make some great art. It’s sad that people have to put up with that behavior just to “make it” in this industry.

[showman91]

Posted: 4/22/21 at 11:09pm

Where are the people now who after the first article were defending him? 

[A Director]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 2:50am

SouthernCakes said: "Yeah it’s sad! He did make some great art. It’s sad that people have to put up with that behavior just to “make it” in this industry."

Really? Rudin isn't demanding; he's abusive. There is a big difference.  It's about time for people to begin to ask why does anyone have to put with this behavior to "make it" in this industry.  For those who say, 'that's show biz,'  the only reply should be FU!

 

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 9:26am

A Director said: "Really? Rudin isn't demanding; he's abusive. There is a big difference. It's about time for people to begin to ask why does anyone have to put with this behavior to "make it" in this industry. For those who say, 'that's show biz,' the only reply should be FU!"

It is the culture and it has to change. This is one of the few industries in which the way in is via internships, the mail room, etc. If you want to become Rudin, you can skip an education and try to survive the abuse until you become the abuser. Like he did,

[Kad]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 9:50am

That Vulture article paints a picture of a man who is not just abusive, but someone who has severe mental health issues.

[Wick3]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 9:52am

HogansHero said: "It is the culture and it has to change. This is one of the few industries in which the way in is via internships, the mail room, etc. If you want to become Rudin, you can skip an education and try to survive the abuse until you become the abuser. Like he did,"

That makes me wonder whether Rudin experienced the same abuse back in the 70s/80s when he was an assistant to other Broadway producers. 

 

[ErmengardeStopSniveling]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 10:17am

Rudin's first job was for the legendary Kermit Bloomgarden (when he was only 16), and Rudin would have to take Bloomgarden's fake leg on public transit to have it repaired. He has also spoken about a poor relationship with his parents.

I'm no psychologist. But a bad upbringing + a feeling that he had to compensate for his young age and lack of college education probably contributed to his behavior. The NYMag piece implies severe OCD and anxiety, perhaps also paired with what we would now call autism and/or psychopathy and/or bipolar disorder.

[HogansHero]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 11:42am

The Vulture piece addresses one "origin story." It seems clear, at a minimum, that Rudin was "taught" that a level of abusive behavior was both acceptable and perhaps required, and also that he has a very deep and layered set of disordered. (In addition to what has been mentioned, NPD and perhaps BPD, seems present to my untrained eye.) I have had a few minor interactions with him and was always struck by what seemed to be his severe inferiority complex, something that seems insignificant compared to some of the other issues.

[Charley Kringas Inc]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 11:50am

It's also just a fact that being in a position of power brings out abusive tendencies in people who harbor them, which isn't helped by the workplace cultural ideal of bosses who will do anything to ensure perfection and high return of capital, even if that means degrading and injuring their employees. I've known people in many positions who are extremely akin to Rudin on a smaller scale, and the implied reasoning behind the abuse is always "if I'm degrading you, it's because you can do better", but it's also just a power trip. There's no getting around the basic truth, which is that sadism is fun, and people in power have unique access to it.

[LizzieCurry]

Posted: 4/23/21 at 11:57am

https://www.vulture.com/2021/04/scott-rudin-hollywood.html

From Tavi Gevinson:

A twin to the “He was nice to me” argument is the “But he has such good taste” argument. I am one of thousands of artists whose work constitutes Scott’s “good taste,” and I don’t want it to be used to justify behavior that traumatized other artists so thoroughly that some of them left the industry. I would also love to stop treating violence and abuse as inevitable to successful art and entertainment. There are plenty of strong examples to the contrary, even if it feels like the treat-people-like-garbage, produce-a-hit formula is tried and true. More likely, it’s just what many people have been forced to accept, and it’s been glamorized for as long as the industry has been able to produce movies like Twentieth Century.

Posted: 4/23/21 at 12:00pm

Charley Kringas Inc said: "I've known people in many positions who are extremely akin to Rudin on a smaller scale"

Fortunately there was a protest yesterday and this will all be fixed once the...

*checks notes*

...actor's union becomes more BIPOC friendly.