Posted: 2/25/25 at 7:01pm
Posted: 2/25/25 at 7:19pm
Sorry...but can we skip all of this "well he should have..." nonsense and get to the question on most of our minds: what is the production like and is there a concept behind it other than it being set in the immediate aftermath of our next election? Also, how are the performances thus far, line reading aside?
Posted: 2/25/25 at 7:59pm
kdogg36 said: "The Other One said: "Denzel called for lines through most of the preview period of The Iceman Cometh.Hickey, of course, is an enormous role. By most accounts, he was on very solid ground with his lines by the time the play opened officially."
Then he needed to start studying the script a few weeks earlier than he did. The preview period exists so that the director can make adjustments based on audience reaction; it isn't to give well-paid professional actors extra time to learn their lines in front of people paying for expensive tickets."
I don't remember people peeing themselves with such flaming self-righteousness when Bette Midler frequently went up on lines during I'll Eat You Last. The great Shakespearean phrase "Calm yo titties" comes to mind.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 8:10pm
In Bette’s defense, that was a one woman show and (correct me if I’m wrong) a totally new play. And I don’t remember paying too much for a ticket to see it.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 8:15pm
I think that’s the issue. People are spending a lot of money and expect a polished production. If folks were spending less, they’d be more flexible and forgiving.
TotallyEffed said: "In Bette’s defense, that was a one woman showand (correct me if I’m wrong) a totally new play. And I don’t remember paying too much for a ticket to see it."
Posted: 2/25/25 at 8:31pm
In 2001 saw Uta Hagen with David Hyde Pierce in Six Dance Lessons in Six Weeks at the Westwood Playhouse in Los Angeles. I lost count of how many times she called LINE. It was very odd and I was a bit scared for her. She was 82. She fell off the stage into the audience latter in the run. Sometimes it would have been better to have stayed home. That would go for Miss Hagen and I.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 8:36pm
It’s been one preview, let’s maybe give it a minute before we ship Denzel off to the retirement home.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 9:04pm
They should set up a hotline so you can talk to Denzel's manager.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 9:19pm
verywellthensigh said: "I don't remember people peeing themselves withsuch flaming self-righteousness when Bette Midler frequently went up on lines during I'll Eat You Last. The great Shakespearean phrase "Calm yo titties" comes to mind."
I wasn't aware of that specific situation, but not knowing one's lines is, pretty much by definition, completely unprofessional regardless of who's involved.
Although I'm not actually peeing my pants, I think my reaction to this is informed by a broader belief about what we should expect from preview performances. Specifically, I think everyone involved in the production has a duty to put out the best performance possible, given the fact that no one yet has the benefit of being subjected to a Broadway audience. Everything - writing, design, acting - should otherwise be as polished as it can be, only awaiting adjustments based on how audiences respond. Nothing should be otherwise in progress or unfinished. I know this might sound demanding or "entitled," but I think it's justified given that audiences are expected to pay good money.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 9:42pm
Othello speaks one third of the dialogue in the play (as does Iago). It is a TON of lines. Ten times out of 1,000 ain’t that bad, lol. I agree that in an ideal world an actor will never have to call for a line in front of an audience, but it was the first preview. Audiences know what previews are, right?
Posted: 2/25/25 at 10:20pm
In this case they're something some people have paid $921 to see (though if they can afford to spend that much on a show I suppose it's difficult to feel too bad for them).
Posted: 2/25/25 at 10:22pm
MemorableUserName said: "In this case they're something some people have paid $921 to see (though if they can afford to spend that much on a show I suppose it's difficult to feel too bad for them)."
I mean, some people do save for months and months to be able to afford to see these unaffordable nights.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 10:37pm
pagereynolds said: "MemorableUserName said: "In this case they're something some people have paid $921 to see (though if they can afford to spend that much on a show I suppose it's difficult to feel too bad for them)."
I mean, some people do save for months and months to be able to afford to see these unaffordable nights."
That's why we don't feel bad for them. Smart people wait months to be able to see affordable nights, which saves a lot.
Posted: 2/25/25 at 10:45pm
MasterThespian 2 said: "Between this, Al Pacino’s struggles in China Doll, Tayne Daly dropping out of Doubt with an “illness,” and George Clooney stressing about blanking onhis lines, makes me think Broadway is a young person's game. For those who have been attending Broadway shows for years, has older performers forgetting their lines always been a thing? Or a more recent occurrence?
Wick3 said: "GottaGetAGimmick420 said: "So, how many times can Denzel call line before that $300+ seat's price tag starts to really sting? Because it's one time too many for me."
Oh wow. He is 70 years old so it may be harder to memorize lines. Since this is a double billing, I can see Denzel fans forgiving him but Jake fans may think otherwise. I applaud Denzel for keeping the first preview as scheduled. In other productions, they would have postponed previews a few days or even a week if the actor or producers felt they weren't ready.
"
"
Tyne was hospitalized. At her age, if something was bad enough to send her to the hospital, I would not think twice about her having to withdraw
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/02/06/theater/tyne-daly-doubt-broadway.html?smid=nytcore-ios-share&referringSource=articleShare
Posted: 2/25/25 at 10:51pm
The Distinctive Baritone said: "Othello speaks one third of the dialogue in the play (as does Iago). It is a TON of lines. Ten times out of 1,000 ain’t that bad, lol. I agree that in an ideal world an actor will never have to call for a line in front of an audience, but it was the first preview. Audiences know what previews are, right?"
Previews are for rewrites, restaging, and finessing tech elements of the show. Not for a lead actor who has been attached to the project for at least 11 months to learn the lines to a 500 year old play.
I mean…I’m giving some grace because again, I don’t know what it’s like to be 70. But this show was announced with Denzel above the title last March, and tickets are $700 for previews. I don’t think an actor should still be calling line in previews with 11 months to prepare and 5 weeks of rehearsal—unless there are rewrites. Anyone know if Will is reworking some scenes? 🤣
Posted: 2/25/25 at 11:26pm
The Distinctive Baritone said: "Othello speaks one third of the dialogue in the play (as does Iago). It is a TON of lines. Ten times out of 1,000 ain’t that bad, lol. I agree that in an ideal world an actor will never have to call for a line in front of an audience, but it was the first preview. Audiences know what previews are, right?"
Well I wouldn't be so sure of that. Sure, seasoned theatergoers know but when I mentioned previews to a coworker (who maybe sees 6 shows a year) she asked about them and I mentioned they were the shows that could be used to tweak cues or adjust lines etc and her response was something along the lines of "you mean I'm paying $150 for a half-baked show?" so imagine that with the prices for Othello
Posted: 2/26/25 at 12:46am
I had to look this up, but there are 3,560 lines in ''Othello.''
Denzel's Othello has 274 lines. Jake's Iago has 1,097 lines.
Iago is second only to Hamlet for having the most lines in Shakespeare. And this is Jake's first time doing the Bard.
I'm astonished by how actors can memorize so many lines. I can barely recall what I had for lunch yesterday.
Updated On: 2/26/25 at 12:46 AM
Posted: 2/26/25 at 1:09am
Wayman_Wong said: "
I'mastonished by how actors can memorize so many lines. I can barely recallwhat I had for lunch yesterday.
"
Money speaks. Not sure how much the leads are making but with $300-$800 range of ticket prices I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s at least $100k a week.
Posted: 2/26/25 at 1:41am
Wayman_Wong said: "I had to look this up, but there are 3,560 lines in ''Othello.''
Denzel's Othello has 274 lines. Jake's Iago has 1,097 lines.
Iago is second only to Hamlet for having the most lines inShakespeare. And this is Jake's first time doing the Bard.
I'mastonished by how actors can memorize so many lines. I can barely recallwhat I had for lunch yesterday.
"
Not sure what your source is on that, but I’m pretty sure it’s wrong. That would make Othello have fewer lines than Desdemona and Emilia.
Othello has 880 lines, Iago 1088, about 200 more. Othello is still one of the biggest parts in Shakespeare.
https://www.shakespeareswords.com/Public/Characters.aspx
STILL, he’s been attached to this for 11 months, so I don’t believe it’s an excuse. I’ve seen hundreds of performances of Shakespeare in my life and I don’t think I’ve ever seen an actor call line in front of an audience—including several Lears, who you might expect it from.
Did see Puck completely go up on his lines though in a production—in the final week of performances. It happens!
Posted: 2/26/25 at 3:35am
''Not sure what your source is on that, but I’m pretty sure it’s wrong.''
I'm no Shakespearean scholar, so I'll bow to others. I just Googled: "how many lines in 'Othello'? And the listing (below) was the first thing to appear. Perhaps, it's wrong, but I found another site, OpenSourceShakespeare.org, that seemed to corroborate Othello's number of lines as 274.
AI Overview
Othello by William Shakespeare has approximately 3,560 lines.
Othello has about 3,560 lines. Iago, a character in Othello, has more lines than the title character, Othello. In fact, Iago has more lines than any other Shakespearean character except Hamlet.
Character line counts
From OpenSourceShakespeare.org:
https://www.opensourceshakespeare.org/views/plays/characters/charlines.php?CharID=othello&WorkID=othello
Updated On: 2/26/25 at 03:35 AM
Posted: 2/26/25 at 4:24am
Dan6 said: "I would still love to hear from someone who was there about the production and performances, apart from the missed lines."
Longtime member though this may be my first post. I know people are eager for details. I love to read show reports, so here goes! I was at the first preview and can share some impressions:
As mentioned, the production is set in the near future (October of 202
but could have been set in any time period. There are no cell phones, no overt modern or political references except a carton of Bud Light and contemporary costumes. Minimalist but effective set and lighting. Somewhat odd music choices - a couple of pieces sounded like they were from a Doris Day/Rock Hudson movie.
There were some sound issues and some stumbling over lines by the actors. Denzel Washington did call for his lines several times and seemed very hesitant. We know he is a legendary actor and Shakespeare vet, so I'm sure he'll get it together. But it was unclear if his characterization (seeming to tend more to senility than insanity) was intentional. He repeated words and lines a lot, but I don't know if it was for effect or because he couldn't remember the line. It was uncomfortable at times but still a thrill to see him on stage. When he nails the lines/the character, the crowd really responds.
Jake Gyllenhaal was very good, seemingly in command of the script. I've seen all of his NY stage work and wondered how he'd handle the Bard. No worries there. Some of Iago's scenes with the soldiers and with Rodrigo have a bit of a contemporary feel.
The acting was good from the rest of the cast; Emilia (Kimber Elayne Sprawl) was the standout for me. She gets to righteously rail at Othello and especially Iago. It's a welcome moment of truth and women's power in a play soaked in toxic masculinity. Of course, Emilia pays the price for it.
The classic themes (jealousy, betrayal, racism) are there but I'm not sure this version teaches us or shows us anything new. And maybe it doesn't have to. But it might benefit from having a stronger modern esthetic, something to set it apart, make it resonate.
I'm eager to see it again, to see if I can relax into the story without the anxiety of watching DW struggle. Not sure how much can or will change at this point, so far into the process but it will be interesting to find out.
Updated On: 2/26/25 at 04:24 AM
Posted: 2/26/25 at 5:39am
I’ve been on Broadway World a long time. I’ve lived through the P*tti M*rin disaster, a troll pretending to want to see Cats after it closed and getting angry at her daughter for it closing, among other things and this is by far in the top 3 most obnoxious threads I’ve ever seen.
Posted: 2/26/25 at 7:24am
This isn't even in the 3 worst I've seen this year (the Sunset Blvd. and Gypsy threads in particular have been vortexes of insanity this one can't even approach), but okay.
On topic: Reddit commenters reported DW didn't call for any lines Tuesday night; may have lost his lines a few times but found his way back.
Updated On: 2/26/25 at 07:24 AM
Posted: 2/26/25 at 7:44am
Reading all these posts about Denzel losing his way and calling for lines makes me wonder how Kenny Leon is handling it. Anecdotally (from friends who have been in his productions), he runs a very tight ship and can be rather exacting when it comes to executing his vision. Even the few times I’ve met him, he seems to know exactly what he wants in a production,
I can’t imagine he’s taking kindly to his legendary leading man calling lines or going to the white room as often has been reported
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