Nicole Scherzinger- Page 2

[binau]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 11:53am

kdogg36 said: "binau said: "And if people aren't allowed to put their ideas in the open to be challenges and criticised nothing will ever change."

No one's being arrested for sharing their opinions. That's the only thingour society guarantees, and I would fight to the death to protect that guarantee. But some opinions deserve nothing but condemnation, shunning, termination from employment.That ispreciselythe way to police abhorrentspeechin a free society."

Ok I understand the utopia vision but how do you control the risk that the people who decide what opinions are worth terminating employment for are the ones that you want? I know it's easier for you because you just said you wouldn't want to work for an employer that supports trump (i.e. it would be mutually agreeable) but I assume many people won't be in such a privileged position to choose and their entire livelihood depends on their work.....

[Georgeanddot2]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 11:56am

It's hilarious how short our memories are. John McCain and Mitt Romney were just as evil and morally bankrupt as Trump, they just had more decorum.

[BETTY22]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 11:57am

ALW is as huge Trump fan tooo. And don't forget Jeff Bazos was at opening night. 

[Lot666]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:00pm

BETTY22 said: "ALW is as huge Trump fan tooo."

Where did you get that from?

[g.d.e.l.g.i.]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:21pm

I'd like to return to hearing uncomfortable viewpoints and being open to debate. And if we were back in the era where people whose beliefs I disagree with chose to practice decorum, I might even think that there was a shot at changing minds.

Here's the thing: over the past decade and change, the line between "teenage edgelord" and legitimate political rhetoric has become increasingly blurred. Those just voted into power and their supporters sound like screenshots of anons on Tumblr posted to Reddit in 10-year-old cringe compilations by college students because, unfortunately, that's what's forming a lot of beliefs now.

For example, no Democrats, be they extreme left (or what passes for it in America) or party establishment, are saying that they hate white men or that white men are the root of all evil. (Look up what they actually say if you think they are, reader; maybe you'll be surprised.) But...

...circlejerk Internet spaces are inferring that...

...online personalities are capitalizing on the gender war nearly omnipresent in most corners of the Internet today...

...most kids are terminally online (it's replaced TV as the screen babysitter), at a time when they don't have the critical reasoning skills to separate facts from fiction and are more interested in the staying power of quips and memes than making meaningful changes to the world around them...

...the algorithm built to engage clicks through ragebait feeds them more based on what they find...

...the parents don't push back because they're tired in a time when it's equally as tough to raise kids as it is to grow up, and they're economically worse off than their parents for the first time since the Great Depression, and they don't know how to deal with their child's unfettered access to technology because they are the first generation to have such things (run-on for emphasis)...

...and we have the nerve to act surprised when Gen-Z grows up and pulls the lever in Trump's direction.

I'd like to model a decorous response, but young or old, Trump supporters very publicly don't give a damn about the behavior we're trying to model. (I wish they did, it would make this a lot easier. The ones that do don't speak up for fear of getting shouted down by their own side or because they think they're not directly affected by any changes, and that's just as bad.) It is evident in every public and private space in which they speak. Luckily we're only getting the mild side in this thread with the poster who crows that he won a fair election. It's much worse in other places.

They don't care whether or if we accept the win, graciously or otherwise. All they care about is that they "owned" us. ("Pwned" us, if you prefer l33tspeak.) All they care about is that their rudimentary understanding of the economy is satisfied. (That's gonna turn around within a few years, not that I think they'll learn anything from it.) All they care about is that they "regained ground" they were told was being taken from them, and ensuring it's never taken away again. They'll learn it comes at a cost, probably too late for it to matter.

I understand where you're all coming from, but this is a new world, and I'm a little tired of pretending that the other side as a whole can be reasoned with when it is plain that some of them can't, and those that can have made ineffectual (at best) efforts to rein them in, and those that can't are (or are about to be, within the next decade or less) the ones in the driver's seat.

Updated On: 11/8/24 at 12:21 PM

[JasonC3]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:29pm

Georgeanddot2 said: "It's hilarious how short our memories are. John McCain and Mitt Romney were just as evil and morally bankrupt as Trump, they just had more decorum."

Pure hyperbole. Neither were/are saints, but neither provoked a riot against the Capitol, tried to stop certification of an election,  threatened legal revenge against their opponents, surrounded themselves with incompetent grifters on their staff, .... the list could go on and on and on. 

Guess it must be hilarious that your memory is too short for all that, particularly since Romney has made many principled public objections to Trump in recent years.

[Georgeanddot2]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:35pm

JasonC3 said: "Georgeanddot2 said: "It's hilarious how short our memories are. John McCain and Mitt Romney were just as evil and morally bankrupt as Trump, they just had more decorum."

Pure hyperbole. Neither were/are saints, but neither provoked a riot against the Capitol, tried to stop certification of an election, threatened legal revenge against their opponents, surrounded themselves with incompetent grifters on their staff, .... the list could go on and on and on.

Guess it must be hilarious that your memory is too short for all that, particularly since Romney has made many principled public objections to Trump in recent years."

Their political positions were just as racist, homophobic, transphobic, anti-woman, and anti-working people as Trump's. Like I said, it's Trump's  "decorum" that most neolib democrats have a real issue with. I think most of you would probably vote for Romney if he ran as a Democrat lol.

Updated On: 11/8/24 at 12:35 PM

[ChrisTyler1288]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:35pm

Consider signing this petition about Nicole’s status in Sunset Blvd 

Sunset Blvd Petition

[binau]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:41pm

Georgeanddot2 said: "JasonC3 said: "Georgeanddot2 said: "It's hilarious how short our memories are. John McCain and Mitt Romney were just as evil and morally bankrupt as Trump, they just had more decorum."

Pure hyperbole. Neither were/are saints, but neither provoked a riot against the Capitol, tried to stop certification of an election, threatened legal revenge against their opponents, surrounded themselves with incompetent grifters on their staff, .... the list could go on and on and on.

Guess it must be hilarious that your memory is too short for all that, particularly since Romney has made many principled public objections to Trump in recent years."

Their political positions were just as racist, homophobic, transphobic, anti-woman, and anti-working people as Trump's."

I can't really speak for the race elements, but in terms of sexual minority rights and women's rights you're are 100% correct that a lot of these legacy Christian theocratic type people in the Republican Party are just as bad, if not worse than Trump. Do people not remember in 2016 when Trump was accused of having 'New York values' by his competition? As you said Trump has less decorum and of course his questionable antics RE: democracy is something we haven't seen before but I can't help but feel anyone who thinks Trump is a unique threat to sexual minorities or women must be under the age of 25....

 

[TheQuibbler]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:49pm

binau said: "I can't really speak for the race elements, but in terms of sexual minority rights and women's rights you're are 100% correct that a lot of these legacy Christian theocratic type people in the Republican Party are just as bad, if not worse than Trump. Do people not remember in 2016 when Trump was accused of having 'New York values' by his competition? As you said Trump has less decorum and of course his questionable antics RE: democracy is something we haven't seen before but I can't help but feel anyone who thinks Trump is a unique threat to sexual minorities or women must be under the age of 25...."

I think the difference now, though, is that Roe v. Wade has been overturned (when it had traditionally been considered "the law of the land" even when states were doing the bare minimum) and when Romney/McCain were running, gay marriage wasn't legal, now is, and is in danger of possibly also being overturned (in addition to the loss of parental rights for these couples). I think the stakes have shifter and they're higher now.

[QueenAlice]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 12:59pm

ChrisTyler1288 said: "Consider signing this petition about Nicole’s status in Sunset Blvd

Sunset Blvd Petition "

You are asking people to sign a petition based on a lot of knee jerk and unsubstantiated accusations. It's behavior like this that have essentially invalidated petitions from actually having any power in modern society. Think about that and then go lobby for something that might actually cause some positive change in the world.

[The Scorpion]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 1:07pm

Lot666 said: "BETTY22 said: "ALW is as huge Trump fan tooo."

Where did you get that from?"

Yeah, that isn't true. He had an apartment in Trump Tower but that's long gone. I wouldn't be surprised if he's tight-lipped about in the States but in the UK media he has been less than complimentary about Mr Trump. He's right wing but his membership of the UK Conservative Party has been cancelled as they went more populist and he was against Brexit. RUG has repeatedly issued cease and desist warnings to Trump about playing ALW's stuff at rallies. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Tim Rice liked Trump, but that's a different matter.

[everythingtaboo]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 1:52pm

For the love of God, people. Theatre folks care about this. The general public doesn't. As long as the money keeps rolling in and making the theatre owners - who likely vote Republican, but not MAGA - they're just going to wait until things blow over. 

One could lose track of just how many CEOs of our favorite brands vote Republican and espouse conservative values.

[blaxx]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 2:08pm

binau said: "Wait, so I only just found out the comment. Is it that she just wants a ‘Jesus first’ hat? Isn’t that easily explainable if she is a Christian? Why do we think this is MAGA except the hats are styled the same?"

With all due respect, I often find your views on the underrepresented to be quite privileged. You may disagree but you obviously don't have a good scope on matters that repress and harm these groups. No, it's not "drama" but it may seem this way to you when you will never suffer from these perspectives like we have.

[Impeach2017]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 2:28pm

So, for the next four years and probably beyond, our people will be demonized by some of the worst sorts of scum imaginable.  Our democracy will be left in tatters, if it even exists at all.  Europe will be divided up, with Putin and his agent concreting their secret pacts.  Yes, friends, the future looks bright!  And here comes your new princess to lead the way, and she's ready for her closeup.

[SeanD2]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 2:40pm

ChrisTyler1288 said: "Consider signing this petition about Nicole’s status in Sunset Blvd

Sunset Blvd Petition "

Oh come on. 1) Change.org petitions don't do anything ever. 2) Everyone has the right to vote and campaign for the candidate they want, 3) this is just childish 

[DrMonicaDeMoneco]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 2:44pm

I hope she puts out a statement - a video statement. I don’t want a statement that some publicist puts out. 

[binau]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 2:45pm

It's possible, but I also acknowledge that not living in the US or being American I don't subscribe to the kind of identity politics that you do and I assume you all can appreciate that neither do or did the rest of the world until you starting exporting them to us because of the massive influence of USA on western culture (or tried to but it didn't always land softly with foreigners, such as the Slave Play 'black out' nights in the UK which even the PM of the UK who is a racial minority condemned). And just because they come from the USA does not mean I think they are always the best ideas or achieve the goals you want them to as I watch everyone tearing each other apart. 

I can summarise example topics I remember below, but you're right to sense that there are a number of controversies or issues relating to some of these issues where it might feel like they come from a place of privilege but in my mind they come from a place of common sense. I completely understand the emotions behind each of these controversies and why they occurred, but it's hard for me to watch these happen without calling out what I see as the craziness behind it: 

* The great comet Fiasco (I think so unjust and unfair when the sales were objectively tanking, Oak was paid out and the plan was always to bring Mandy in)

* The recent Patti Hell's Kitchen fiasco (very unreasonable that someone cannot comment on the objective sound levels of a show)

* Challenging the implication that Patti LuPone would have no business playing 'Evita' today because she isn't ethnically latino, even though Eva Peron was Caucasian

* Challenging the idea of racially segregating UK audiences with 'Slave Play' to help people be 'free from the white gaze', as mentioned above

* Having to defend non-USA Western countries of accusations here being made of them being 'racist' when they appear to deal with multi-cultural and racial integration in much more effective and less divisive ways than the USA

* I agree with the idea that a black ensemble member being fired because they are black even though it had good social intentions (i.e. preventing a 'white savior' type optics) is racism and should not have happened

I want to make sure I don't unwittingly enter the territory of showing so much skepticism that I am then blind to the genuine hardships, problems and discrimination faced by underrepresented groups. But I think it's important that we are very careful what we code as problematic vs not problematic for the good of all groups because we don't want to cause division where it's not necessary and we want the grievences of underepresented people to be taken seriously. 

Also, I know I can probably be annoying sorry and say stupid stuff all the time I don't expect everyone to agree with me I just want to give my honest thoughts and always appreciate the genuine discussion and challenge when it happens. 

Updated On: 11/8/24 at 02:45 PM

[PipingHotPiccolo]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:19pm

Binau, I am not a fan of cancel culture and I fully agree that you are identifying examples of woke culture run amok. which i think is illiberal extremism, and i think helps hand elections to wanna be dictators. 

but who is calling for Nicole to be fired? Are you suggesting that I should go see Mel Gibson movies even though hes an avowed antiSemite and racist? Surely you wouldnt overlook someone being a Klan supporter or Hamas supporter when picking what to spend $ to go see?

So a line is drawn, and the question is just where do you draw that line. I am very comfortable drawing it just before someone who is *not* a Trump voter, but a Trump supporter--someone who seems to cheerlead his WORST cohorts like Tucker Carlson and Russel Brand, truly despicable people by any measure (politics aside!). It seems wild of you to suggest that our revulsion at that support--our inability or refusal to just go along with it as if its "a different political opinion"--is somehow problematic. 

[DrMonicaDeMoneco]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:21pm

https://www.buzzfeed.com/stephaniesoteriou/nicole-scherzinger-backlash-russell-brand-donald-trump-post

[Call_me_jorge]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:21pm

There actually is a change dot com petition to get Nicole fired, but I agree with your other sentiments.

[RippedMan]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:22pm

blaxx said: "binau said: "Wait, so I only just found out the comment. Is it that she just wants a ‘Jesus first’ hat? Isn’t that easily explainable if she is a Christian? Why do we think this is MAGA except the hats are styled the same?"

With all due respect, I often find your views on the underrepresented to be quite privileged. You may disagree but you obviously don't have a good scope on matters that repress and harm these groups. No, it's not "drama" but it may seem this way to you when you will never suffer from these perspectives like we have."

She liked a Tucker Carlson video too which to me is far worse and unexplainable. 

[The Distinctive Baritone]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:34pm

I agree that the calls for her to be fired are not only ridiculous (since she could sue the producers for tons of money and easily win), but...this is not how a democracy works. I hate Trump with every bone in my body, but...it was her vote, and her right.

Also, Trump won by a lot this time - a very solid majority - so unless you live in NYC, Chicago, or LA, deciding that you are never going to associate with people who voted for Trump is simply not an option. We have to all find a way to at least tolerate each other, whether we like it or not.

That said, the video she made of herself on her way to vote - knowing now who she clearly voted for - reveals her to be a total narcissist. Maybe she can save herself by making an apology video saying that this was just method acting for Norma Desmond that went too far? lol

[binau]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:36pm

PipingHotPiccolo I have said a few times that I agree everyone has the personal choice not to attend Nicole's performance given this information and I never suggested otherwise. I absolutely agree with you. I don't agree that Nicole should be out of a job as many people have called for, or expect or think that she should lose the Tony award for this. If she gives the best performance of the season and wins the Tony Award even if people boo her speech because of her views I would find that a more preferable outcome than automatically ruling it out because of her political beliefs. 

I hope the leadership of the Democratic Party are the first ones to be cancelled here - they are the ones that failed you starting with Biden who held onto power for far too long and starting causing this mess. This is outrageous and yet we make him sound like a hero.

I chuckle at kdogg's comment that Nicole can likely plead ignorance, I actually kind of agree lol. Maybe I'm naive but I really don't think Nicole is sitting in the St James dressing room plotting against racial minorities (of which she is one), queer people of which she appears to have support for , or women of whom she is one. I assume that it's either ignorance or her religious beliefs that have influenced her decision. But I don't know why we are going after her as if she is the real problem. She just wants to bring joy for an evening of theatre - I kind of hate that she did this because she should know how divided America is right now and that she literally has a job to do. I hate that many will now never enjoy her performance or not look back at it fondly. Feels like such a waste. 

Updated On: 11/8/24 at 03:36 PM

[blaxx]

Posted: 11/8/24 at 3:46pm

binau said: "PipingHotPiccolo I have said a fewtimes that I agree everyone has the personal choice not to attend Nicole's performance given this information and I never suggested otherwise. I absolutely agree with you. I don't agree that Nicole should be out of a job as many people have called for, or expect or think that she should lose the Tony award for this. If she gives the best performance of the season and wins the Tony Award even if people boo her speech because of her views I would find that a more preferable outcome than automatically ruling it out because of her political beliefs.

I hope the leadership of the Democratic Party are the first ones to be cancelled here - they are the ones that failed you starting with Biden who held onto power for far too long and starting causing this mess. This is outrageous and yet we make him sound like a hero.

I chuckle at kdogg's comment that Nicole can likely plead ignorance, I actually kind of agree lol. Maybe I'm naive but I really don't think Nicole is sitting in the St James dressing room plotting against racial minorities (of which she is one), queer people of which she appears to have support for, or women of whom she is one. I assume that it's either ignorance or her religious beliefs that have influenced her decision. But I don't know why we are going after her as if she is the real problem. She just wants to bring joy for an evening of theatre - I kind of hate that she did this because she should know how divided America is right now and that she literally has a job to do. I hate that many will now never enjoy her performance or not look back at it fondly. Feels like such a waste."

Love, actions have consequences. Agai,n, you don't get the full scope of the matter, you're simply focusing on the production. This would follow her anywhere. You're acting like we can go around the world having different personalities to suit the environment. Life doesn't work like that.